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Kevbo: "Ain't no thang, y'all, dang."

"It's fun radio show talk, but this isn't a big deal. It's not vindictive or anything. I'm a Baltimore Oriole, period, and this has nothing to do with anything but throwing out the first pitch. The Orioles aren't in the playoffs right now, but you still root for your friends to do well."

My real problem with this, now (since I've said enough about my initial issues), is that Millar and probably the Orioles don't seem to get why people wouldn't like this.

Hey! Kevin! The Red Sox aren't your friends. The Red Sox are nobody's friends. If the Red Sox were an ice cream flavor, they'd be pralines...and dick.

LIVE IN THE NOW!

Look, I agree that it makes no difference for Kevin Millar, for the Orioles, for the Red Sox, for the fact that I hate the Red Sox, for the fact that the Red Sox might occasionally find us to be a mild annoyance, for the 2008 season, for game seven of the ALCS, the Indians, the World Series, 2004, the global business climate, Tippecanoe and Tyler, too.

It makes a difference in public perception, though. He's an Oriole. I know in my heart of hearts and all that romance novel jive that Kevin Millar didn't mean for this to look bad in any way. I know he'll show up next season and play his ass off and try, and fail, to make this team worth watching.

I'm not saying don't root for your friends. I'm not saying don't go to the game! Buy a ticket. Shit, go sit with Theo, who cares? But being on the field and doing Red Sox PSAs like you're still connected to that team anywhere but in the glowing hearts of millions of pink-hatted nincompoops just makes us all look like idiots for bothering to root for you all year when you clearly wish to be elsewhere. And it kinda makes ya look like a sad puppy, Kevster.

"Hi, this is Kevin Millar! You may remember me from the World Series champion Boston Red Sox of 2004! I may spend my current summers moonlighting with the Baltimore Orioles, but know that I'm really rootin' for ya! Cowboy up! Cowboy up! We're such good friends!"

He might as well have bought a uniform from the concession stand. Pink hat and all.

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re:
"play his ass off and try, and fail, to make this team worth watching"

This may be true, but the fact that he'll likely be one of the better players is the precise reason the O's will suck yet again. A team of Millars would fail to make the team worth watching. He doesn't qualify as anything more than a bit player on a decent team.

After this Wally episode passes, the O's are facing an off season where they'll be staring at yet another 90+ loss team that has few bargaining chips for disassembling. Also, not much ready in the minors. It ain't getting better any time soon. The O's brass may not understand the Wally lashback, but I sure hope they understand the coming lashback regarding the continued suckage. They haven't had a clue about much for close to 15 years now.

by drj on Oct 23, 2007 11:45 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

It's this sorry state of the Orioles
that has me upset.  Not anything Kevin Millar did.  Millar is nothing more than a former Red Sox who is playing out the string with the O's.  That's what we should be upset about.  That Millar is what we are reduced to getting emotional about.

by timg56 on Oct 24, 2007 9:29 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That was...
...a beautiful Wayne's World reference.
--- Do not taunt Happy Fun Ball.

by EmbassyRow on Oct 24, 2007 12:03 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Love that line
Great flick.
Jamie Walker T-shirts: http://www.cafepress.com/beltwaysports

by CStoneNo37 on Oct 24, 2007 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

re: "My real problem with this now...
is that Millar and probably the Orioles don't seem to get why people wouldn't like this."

Yup, those are indeed two really scary things, to which you have to add a third: some recent contributors to this blog apparently don't get it either. One fella likened the episode to somebody going to a company picnic at the place where he used to work [!]. Y'know, have a brewski, roast some wienies, what's the big deal...Yikes!

NB: this is not Titov drunkenly ripping on people who express an opinion on KM's actions; hey, free country, express your brains out, etc. This is Titov drunkenly expressing dismay that the three constituencies above evidently do not fully perceive (or do so only in order to dismiss them) the sentiments of dismay, outrage, betrayal, etc., felt and voiced by others.

MLB's fraternization rule is apropos here, for the concept as much as the rule proper (which I can't cite). We all know players on opposing teams may be friends; but we all agree-- MLB, players and fans-- that these friends are not going to pal around on the diamond before a game because the perception this fosters is anithetical to the whole concept we're selling and buying, that these are determined opponents.

And the protection of this perception should (indeed must) extend to all MLB game functions, regardless of whether one of the perceived opponents is, in fact, off duty while the other is not. When you're in a theater, which is what a ball park is, of course, the rules of the "play world" must be observed.

When you're watching a production of Hamlet, you don't expect the performance to begin as the melancholy Dane, sword in hand and wearing tights, steps before the audience and says "Let's have a hand for my friend Chuck, who's going to do the voice-over thing at the beginning tonight to kick us off. He used to play the king [boo! hiss!] when we did this thing in Ontario, but we fired him and now he's appearing in a theater of the absurd production in Baltimore, I think it is. Anyway, c'mon out and take a bow, Chuck!"  

When you're in a movie theater watching a crime drama, you do not expect an actor to turn to the camera and announce "Folks, the dude playing the gangtser is actually a nice guy, wouldn't hurt a flea in real life." That kind of breaking of the 4th wall is Just Not Right, and would likely be met with demands for refunds by various of the paying audience who expect certain perceptions to be maintained. Ferris Bueller can face the camera and talk to us; Elliot Ness can't (and a suited-up Hamlet shouldn't).

I'm not against fraternizing as such, even on (or near) the playing field in some sports: one of the nice things about college lacrosse was splitting a keg with the other team after a game, a practice that rugby also seems to encourage. But nobody was paying to see us play college lacrosse (and a good thing, too) and there was no agreement that we would observe the exteriors of "opponent status" before or after games.

If KM and the Orioles FO think what they are involved in marketing is a club sport or a comedy, and that the linked perceptions of opponents-arena (theater)-rivalry are merely some sort of option the delusional can maintain if they want, then they are very much mistaken-- and very much need to be reminded of this.

If certain other fans feel that reminding them, and in no uncertain terms, amounts to some sort of overreaction (aside from the use of obscenities, which is a different issue), then I am here to say No, it is not. It is a natural reaction. And we wish you perceived that.

Even metaphorically speaking, the Warehouse isn't a warehouse. It's an outhouse. What does that make Petey?

by Titov on Oct 24, 2007 3:26 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

As the guy that used the picnic reference...
... allow me the time to remind you of a couple of facts.

Try watching what goes on at first base when a runner is on.  It's not unusual to see the runner and the first baseman talking, smiling, sharing a joke, ... who knows, discussing where they are going out to eat that night.  I'm not sure where you get this idea that atheletes today have a continuous "us and them" attitude.  It just ain't so.  Yet according to you, only those in certain sports can fraternize, while it's inappropriate for others.

While I love the attitude of Bob Gibson and would jump at having a team full of players having that same mind set, I am also familiar with the idea of good sportmanship, of helping up the player you just tackled or knocked down, of congratulating your opponent on a job well done.

Professional sports lost the sense of players "belonging" to teams and hence to the fans a long time ago.  There are no more Cal Ripkens and Tony Gwynns.  (OK, Craig Biggio and Derek Jeter and perhaps a couple others still fall in this category, but they are an endangered species.)  Unless your team is filled with players developed in your minor league system, it's a collection of professionals playing for the highest bidder.

There's a flip side as well.  How many here have called for trading Roberts and Bedard to build for the future?  Both are home grown birds, but we'll send them packing in the hope of fulfilling our own desire of having a winning team to root for again.

The season is over.  Millar's action should rate not much more than an annoyance.  The fact that so many have responded the way they have is certainly a sign of over reaction, no matter how much you try to sweep under the rug the crudeness of comment.

I really don't want to be in the position of defending what Kevin Millar did.  One, I don't necessarily agree with it.  Two, regardless of #1, I don't really care that much about it.  But the response by a significant number of O's fans has been such that it's embarrasing.  Those who really don't like what Millar did are only making the problem worse by calling attention to what a sorry lot we've become.  Now it's not just the organization that's a joke.  It's the fans as well.

by timg56 on Oct 24, 2007 10:10 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

TimG, you have no clue
this DOES go past what Kevin Mascot did.  it does illustrate a great deal about how the Orioles continue to underestimate their actions in the public eye.  this has nothing to do with players chatting at first base, or sharing agents, or getting beers after the game.

this has everything to do with the public respect of the Baltimore Orioles organization.  in feebly introducing Kevin Mascot on Fox, Joe Buck said; "And here's former Red Sox first baseman Kevin Millar on now to throw out the first pitch".  in all the face time Mascot had on Fox, NOT FUCKING ONCE was it mentioned that he's STILL UNDER FUCKING CONTRACT for the Baltimore Orioles, which as a public trust (believe me i know the slippery slope there), is an extension of Baltimore itself.

for if we as fans don't acknowledge that when we root for a team we root for everything that team represents, what is the value of rooting for a particular team to begin with?  most of us determine who we root for very early on, either as a function of where we live or who our family roots for.  so yes, when a current member of MY TEAM and MY CITY appears on NATIONAL FUCKING TV in support of one of our most hated rivals, it fucking pisses me off to no end.

you would never, ever, EVER, see a traded or sold English soccer player return to his former pitch to schill for his old team.  cause he would get a fucking knife in the gut as soon as he walked out of the stadium.

so, TimG, i don't care how long you've been an O's fan or whatever, but telling me that the O's fans that have a problem with this are a joke, well sir, you can go fuck off, because you don't have any clue as to what being a fan really is.  you probably like Duke basketball too.

"I love you guys....I hate you guys." --Eric Cartman

by Dave at Bottomfeeder Baseball on Oct 24, 2007 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

DaBfB: Your last line-- inspired!
Even metaphorically speaking, the Warehouse isn't a warehouse. It's an outhouse. What does that make Petey?

by Titov on Oct 24, 2007 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Some of you are real gems.
Can't you argue your points without putting words into the other person's mouth, resorting to profanities or personal attacks?

I guess because I grew up outside of DC and now live in the Pacific NW, I must be less of an O's fan.  And as for calling O's fans a joke - when was that exactly?  I did say that the response of some - which I provided quotes from - were unreasonably vitriolic and bordering on pathetic.  I never said that fans having a problem with Millar were a joke.  

Perhaps the fact I've been removed from the NE for almost 20 years means I don't have a "hatred" for Red Sox fans (or Yankee fans, or any other team you want to pick).  So, yes, it's possible that I don't understand that churn your guts emotion seeing Millar yakking it up with his former teammates might mean to some.  But rather than explaining that, all you can do is tell me to fuck off and state I don't have a clue what it means to be a fan.  Perhaps you could at least tell me where you got your certificate that qualifies you to determine who is a fan and who isn't.

BTW Dave - I'm a Maryland grad.  Liking Duke basketball is inimical to my nature.

by timg56 on Oct 24, 2007 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Well....
if you haven't been to Camden Yards for a Red Sox game recently, when thousands of Red Sox fans stroll in and triumphantly declare our ballpark "Fenway South" and generally engage in loutish and disrepectful behavior (not all of them, mind you, but enough), then I wouldn't expect you to get it.

I get why the Sox fans are showing up in Baltimore, but when you're in someboday else's house you should behave respectfully, not claim you own the place or engage in abusive behavior towards the other team's fans. Doing so will not earn you a lot of love from fans of other teams, even if you think you deserve it because your team went 86 years without a championship.

Anyway, the experience of that is probably why some here are more P.O.'d than others, and why some have more animosity toward Red Sox fans than others.

by rebop on Oct 24, 2007 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Now it's not just the organization that's a joke
"It's the fans as well".

direct quote from the last line of your entry i replied to.

i apologize for the profanity.  but i felt i was pretty clear about what you weren't understanding about why this is so maddening.

and i'm not sure proximity has alot to do with it, but i go to the games at CY and have to deal with it being 80% full of stupid "Fenway Park South" t-shirts.  yeah, it bothers me.  a great deal.  maybe you haven't been part of that phenomenon.

but it comes down to this fundemental point:  Millar, and the O's front office, whether they meant to offend or not, did.  it's not the intent, it's the result.  i was offended.  and so were plenty of others around here and around town.  he's not just himself standing out there acting like a jackass and schilling for the Red Sox.  he represents the Baltimore Orioles, and by extension, Baltimore and by further extension, ME!

and i WOULD NEVER, EVER, EVER, throw out the first pitch at a Red Sox game or tell the stupid Red Sox to "Cowboy Up" on national tv.

"I love you guys....I hate you guys." --Eric Cartman

by Dave at Bottomfeeder Baseball on Oct 24, 2007 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I haven't had the direct experience
of Red Sox's fans at games. It's rare I even get to see a game on TV.  Lacking that experience, I accept that it is indeed true I don't get it.  As such I apologize for critizing those of you whose fan mind set is influenced by factors different from mine.

by timg56 on Oct 24, 2007 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I haven't had the direct experience
of Red Sox's fans at games. It's rare I even get to see a game on TV.  Lacking that experience, I accept that it is indeed true I don't get it.  As such I apologize for critizing those of you whose fan mind set is influenced by factors different from mine.

by timg56 on Oct 24, 2007 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Sorry about the repeats.
I was experiencing some sort of glich that made it look as if my post wasn't going through.

by timg56 on Oct 24, 2007 6:46 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Oh come on
The Red Sox aren't his friends but individuals are.  Former colleagues from a past workplace.  Anyone who is in a profession in which they have had 2 jobs has a former workplace.  And we are friends even tho' we compete for grant money.

Let's skewer Brian Roberts for sitting on the same bench and -- horrors -- talking to Red Sox players he was teammates with during the All Star game.

by Montego76 on Oct 24, 2007 10:27 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

oh come on is right
It's a Wayne's World joke.

Not that that makes your All-Star game analogy any better whatsoever.

A TYPICAL, DISGUSTING DISPLAY!

by SC on Oct 24, 2007 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

btw
Does remind me of another of my favorite photos:

A TYPICAL, DISGUSTING DISPLAY!

by SC on Oct 24, 2007 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

re:
Oh yeah, I remain buddies with guys who have moved onto new jobs. However, I do not go to their company and root them on as they undertake a new work. My company wouldn't allow it. The Orioles seem to have no problem with Millar doing a commercial that did the same. Nor do you. I don't get that. All I know is if I did that where I work, I'd face getting fired.

by drj on Oct 24, 2007 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

or...
would you go to the firm you used to work at for something celebrating getting work your new firm bid on?

i wouldn't think that'd be approrpriate, but, hey...

by jq higgins on Oct 24, 2007 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Would someone
please mention that sports are unique and there is no possible workplace analogy that will make any sense whatsoever?  Players on one team throwing out ceremonial first pitches for other "rival" teams is weird and uncomfortable, and probably annoying to fans of the lesser team!  Even though they shouldn't freak out to the embarassing degree going on here!  But it's not like your office!  

by Awesome Mike Awesome on Oct 24, 2007 11:57 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

You Folks complaining -dont understand
First if Kevin did buy a Red Sox uniform at the concession stand it would be the first Pro Baseball Uniform he would have worn in over 2 years.
(KIDDING)

KM in Boston is well respected and because of his role in 04 will ALWAYS be remembered. He is a genuine player that  has true feelings for alot of the members of this sox team.  It would not bother me if (pick a Sox Player) participated in the Orioles post season activity. First If you realize who they had the night before KM you see they were bringing back key players from that 04 season. The Sox contacted ownership and got permission.

It was not meant to be nor should it be considered a swipe at the O's or the fans of Baltimore.

by ajh on Oct 24, 2007 2:43 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

it DOES NOT matter
it doesn't matter if it was MEANT to be a "swipe" at the O's or the fans.  BUT IT FUCKING WAS.

say you're driving home tonight in the rain and crash into a school bus by accident and kill a dozen children.  you obviously didn't MEAN to do it, so does that mean we should leave you off the hook?  of course not.

how about something more subtle?  you're at work and you tell a dirty joke to a co-worker who is a very good and trusted friend, but it's overheard by someone who takes offense.  you didn't MEAN to offend that person, but you did and are now legally liable for an incident of "hostile workplace", leading to termination or prosecution.

the INTENT in any of these cases isn't relevant.  only the RESULT is.

Mascot Millar didn't MEAN to offend O's fans.  The O's front office didn't MEAN to further alienate the further-dwindling fan base.  but their RESULT is they did.

"I love you guys....I hate you guys." --Eric Cartman

by Dave at Bottomfeeder Baseball on Oct 24, 2007 3:18 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

re:
I get the Sox fan's perspective on this, but I probably would've said I wouldn't care before I actually saw it happen. It's like our tenth straight god awful season finally ended, and we were trying to just watch the playoffs, but here comes Millar with the front office's blessing to remind us again that we suck. WE KNOW.

"Hey, can we borrow one of your players for inspiration?"

One of the following three answers:
A. "You want an Oriole for inspiration?"
B. "YES! Oh, to again be Boston's stupid little brother! Hey, remember when we helped you clinch? Totally bros, right? Hey, we hate the Yankees, too! Hello? Hello?"
C. "Sure, dad."

It's bad enough we generally get embarrassed on the field of play. Now they're dragging it out into the postseason without actually making the playoffs.

A TYPICAL, DISGUSTING DISPLAY!

by SC on Oct 24, 2007 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Would you be okay with it...
if the Red Sox had been eliminated and Manny Ramirez (who grew up in Washington Heights) cut a spot rooting on the Yankees, announced their lineup and threw out the first pitch at Yankee Stadium?

Granted it wouldn't be the strangest thing Manny has ever done, but I doubt Red Sox Nation would take it well.

by rebop on Oct 25, 2007 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

well
Let's even make it comparable, like Schilling in Arizona.

I'll believe Red Sox fans wouldn't have reacted the same way when pigs fly in frozen hell. These Fruit Loops want Terry Francona fired 55% of the year, every year.

A TYPICAL, DISGUSTING DISPLAY!

by SC on Oct 25, 2007 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

I sometimes listen...
to sports talk radio up here. Any game the Sox lose there will be 4 or 5 calls along the lines of "Duude we gotta fire Fran-coma. He's killin' me! Worst managa eva!" It cracks me up.

Anyway, Schilling for the Diamondbacks is maybe a little more comparable in terms of passion (although they're not in the same division or even league). I used the Yankees as an example because most Red Sox fans think the only thing in baseball that anyone should care about is the Yanks/Sox rivalry.

by rebop on Oct 26, 2007 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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