Rays 4, Orioles 2: Yada, yada, yada...

by SC on Sep 22, 2008 11:25 PM EDT in Post-Game Comment 12 comments

Three a-holes going as Chuck Liddell for Halloween (which I realize is a month away) [via d.yimg.com]

Even in a year where we were "surprised" by a "competitive" Orioles team, the Birds are doing their best to remind us that this is yet another crap season from a franchise that has been embarrassing us in public in front of God and everybody for over a decade.

With their sixth straight loss, the O's are 4-15 in September, meaning very little at the end of the day, perhaps, but the familiar September swoon is nonetheless old hat. Take your Orioles Magic DVDs and toss 'em -- this team is no different than the rest.

Bad pitchers pitching badly, 3 0-year old minor leagues hitting a little bit, making some people think they're legitimate major leaguers for next year. You name it, the O's are doing it. Again.

The truth is that this team is nowhere near contention. Not even close. Aubrey Huff isn't going to be putting up .950 OPS numbers every year, as this year had a 150-point jump in that particular statistic. The only truly viable members of the FUTURE of this club that we have run out regularly this year are Nick Markakis, Adam Jones, Jeremy Guthrie, and maybe Jim Johnson. Everyone else is old or getting there, or just not very good.

We've got Matt Wieters, sure, but even Wieters, Markakis and Jones (if Jones starts hitting more than he did this year) don't simply measure up to most teams on their own, particularly in a loaded division that is more than just Boston and New York. The fourth-place Jays are 10 games over .500, for the love of pete, and they had some troubles this year. The Yankees aren't just going to go down without a fight, either, so don't simply expect that. Boston will load up with another good team. The Rays' best players are young.

Gonna be a long road, y'all. This process will not be quick, nor will it be easy. What looked like fun earlier this year has dragged out to another forgettable, awful finish.

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Thank God for the...Redskins?

Terps?

Anyone?

by pipkin on Sep 23, 2008 1:41 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Caps, baby

Great Eight is da man.

"I wasn't here for the losing years. But it feels a little like the days with Earl in charge and John Lowenstein smashing birthday cakes in the middle of the clubhouse with a bat." - John "T-Bone" Shelby

by duck on Sep 23, 2008 6:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Ravens

No love for the hometown team on this site.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Sep 23, 2008 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

my home teams are the teams I grew up with

And sorry duck, I don’t understand hockey (or soccer) and don’t really want to.

by pipkin on Sep 24, 2008 12:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

unlike some of you

I will actually be pretty sad with the conclusion of the season. It’s been fun, even though it sucked.

I get three hours of distraction at work, and I’m gonna miss it.

Ravens are 2-0

The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST

by the fix is in on Sep 23, 2008 7:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

So which is more likely during the off season?

(1) McPhail continues the rebuilding. He works deals for Roberts and Huff, for example, and continues the move towards youth. Oh, and he extends Markakis.

(2) McPhail pulls in a few washed up veterans, probably FA pitchers, and fails to extend Markakis or trade Roberts.

(3) McPhail puts Baltimore on the road jersey and declares success.

This talk of extending Roberts amuses me. It indicates that the Warehouse (read Angelos) is not committed to the rebuild in the sense that any veteran is on the table. I won’t be surprised to hear rumors that Roberts quietly asked to be liberated.

by drj on Sep 23, 2008 9:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

#1 is most likely

I’m as pessimistic as anyone, but there’s no reason to think that MacPhail has deviated from the plan he started last offseason.

Also, I don’t think that extending Roberts is as bad of an idea as you say.

I’d absolutely love to trade Roberts for a package that even remotely resembles the Bedard package, but for whatever reason, Roberts’ value on the trade market is not all that high. The best (and only) offer for Roberts has been assorted spare parts from the Cubs.

Roberts’ value on the field is extremely high. Choose whatever advanced sabermetric stat you want, and it’ll probably tell you that Roberts is one of the 10 or so most valuable position players in the American League.

If Roberts’ trade value is far lower than his actual value, than it may make sense to hang on to him. He’ll probably be a type A free agent which could net the Orioles a couple draft picks in 2010.

Or, if Roberts is willing to extend for a couple years at ~$10MM per, I’d strongly consider that if I’m Andy Macphail. On the other hand, players like Roberts tend to age very poorly, so it might make sense just to trade him or get the draft picks.

If it sounds like I’m talking in circles here, it’s because I don’t think there’s a clear-cut answer to the Roberts problem. We don’t know what teams are offering in trade, and we don’t know what kind of money Roberts is looking for on an extension. Depending on the answers to those two questions, any of the three options (trade/extend/keep for picks) may be the best for the Orioles.

by dkdc on Sep 23, 2008 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’d absolutely love to trade Roberts for a package that even remotely resembles the Bedard package, but for whatever reason, Roberts’ value on the trade market is not all that high. The best (and only) offer for Roberts has been assorted spare parts from the Cubs.

Interesting artilce on Robert’s age curve at camdendepot. I would have taken the Cubs package. No stars in that package but some players that could be useful. In contrast, Roberts will be overpaid very quickly.,

Zartan says, "Sign Dan Johnson."

by birdman on Sep 23, 2008 12:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It all depends on Roberts

McPhail said he would talk extension. That’s a clear indication the O’s plan to keep him around. Does Roberts want to stay? Peter Angelos has a thing for Roberts, but I don’t think anyone would be surprised if the feeling is not mutual and Roberts quietly asks for out. He signed through 2009 with the intention of waiting to see how things develop. Right now, they look pretty bleak after the collapse of this latest wave of pitching. If Roberts isn’t interested in an extension, McPhail will need to shop him. I agree with you he will not be highly coveted in the sense that teams will clamor to offer highly touted prospects.

So, does Markakis care to sign an extension? Assuming the two sides can agree on dollars, the only upside is security. Guaranteed millions is nothing to sneeze at. However, like the rest of us, Markakis has seen no compelling reason to believe in the Orioles future.

But the word in they will have Baltimore on their away jerseys. Thanks for that bold move Pete!

This off season will be more telling than last year’s. Last year was relatively easy in that there were two decent players who declared they wanted out. This year we see if McPhail is really going to continue the rebuilding. I expect something along the lines of (1) get a mediocre FA pitcher – they’ll splurge at about $7 million/year for maybe two years. (2) extend Roberts if he chooses (while he’s at it, he may as well ask for a lot of money as Angelos has already tipped his hand), otherwise shop him. (3) Gauge interest on Huff. (4) Try to extend Markakis. I’ll not be surprised if he says no and goes to arbitration. This stuff is nothing new or creative. Fact is, the O’s don’t have the caliber of player to do much via trades (except maybe Roberts). When I watch the Rays and other good teams, all I keep thinking is badly the O’s suck.

But the word is they’ll suck with Baltimore on the road jerseys. Thanks for the table scraps Pete!

by drj on Sep 23, 2008 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I'd go with two

I think that Markakis will be extended, but not this offseason; I have a very strong feeling that Roberts is going to remain an Orioles, and the Byrd type pitcher rumors are probably going to come true.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Sep 23, 2008 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If you're going to rebuild,

you need at least 1 or 2 B-robs in the clubhouse. Who’s going to teach Markakis how to steal Bases? Who’s going to teach Adam Jones how to work a count? Who’s going to teach any of our miserable excuses for SS’s how to turn 2? Is Terry Crowley gonna do it? Fuck no.

Brian might just be worth whatever they pay him.

(And the original post didn’t mention Luke Scott, who is BIRDLAND.)

1933 was a bad year

by Senatorrosewater on Sep 23, 2008 2:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

You also need players

As SC said, and I’ve been saying for months, this team is so far away from contending and it is a joke when people propose buying this offseason.

My best game plan is to sit on the bench and call out specific instructions like 'C'mon Boog,' 'Get ahold of one, Frank,' or 'Let's go, Brooks.' -Earl Weaver

by Baltimo on Sep 23, 2008 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs