Brooks Robinson

by jsmall404 on May 12, 2009 4:16 PM EDT Comment 28 comments

What current major leaguers do you guys think compare to him? Got into an arguement with a friend and am looking for feedback.

Obviously he has the 16 gold gloves, but only hit 268 career HRs with a career OBP of .322.

Does the fact that he played in 15 all star games matter? or was that a product of the time period?

What are yours thoughts compared to current players and where do you tihnk he ranks in terms of all tme great middle infielders/third basemen?

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Brandon Inge of the Tigers

Serviceable hitter, but great defensively.

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by jobe on May 12, 2009 4:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

re

so all he is is a great defensive 3b? i mean, that isnt a HOF. scott rolen was a great defensive 3b.

by jsmall404 on May 12, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Zimmerman?

by pipkin on May 12, 2009 4:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This.

I’m sure Zimmerman would love to a career like Brooks.

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by getxstoked on May 12, 2009 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

interesting

i might agree with that, for now..obviously its tough comparing 16 seasons to guys with about 5.

the interesting thing is that, no one really thinks zimmerman will be a HOFer. what make robinson so great? was is the lack of players at the position? he made 15 all star teams for crying out loud.

by jsmall404 on May 12, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i think...

zimmerman definitely has the defensive chops, but is a bit bigger and may end up having a more productive offensive peak. i actually tend to think that a guy like eric chavez is not a bad recent comp, at least in terms of defensive bona fides, offensive numbers in peak years and physical similarity.

"If they pitch to you, make them pay."

--Diamond Dave to the Phenom

by j.q. higgins on May 12, 2009 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He's an all-time great.

His bat was just average, but combined with otherworldly defense and a long career and he was one of the greatest third baseman ever to play the game.

There isn’t really a player in the game with a similar glove-heavy profile. If I had to pick someone, Adrian Beltre is probably the closest.

by dkdc on May 12, 2009 5:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

he's a nice guy, too

that always helps

by pipkin on May 12, 2009 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Inge, Chavez and Beltre are all decent comps. Buddy Bell was a really similar player.

Brooks is moderately “overrated” (he’s an all-time top 10 third baseman, but toward the back end of that list), but it’s because you look at his achievements and you go, “Wow, that’s amazing.” He was an otherworldly third baseman and a pretty good hitter in his best years. His MVP in ’64 was completely deserved, but did he deserve ALL those Gold Gloves? Maybe. Did he deserve ALL those All-Star games? Not really, but who does?

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by SC on May 12, 2009 7:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

none of them got a Rockwell painting

The only rockwell painting with a name, in fact. That is not to be underestimated.

And yeah, Brooks wasn’t Brett or Schmidt. He might be a bit overrated. But he was good, and he’s ours.

by pipkin on May 13, 2009 12:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Who compares to Brooks Robinson? Everybody. Brooks set the standard for 3rd base,

Looking at numbers won’t tell the whole story. What really tells about brooks is the words of the players and managers he robbed, time and again. I don’t know how many times I’ve heard them say that palmer, mcnally or cuellar would throw heat inside and there was just NO WAY to hit a ball past brooks robinson.

1933 was a bad year

by Senatorrosewater on May 13, 2009 2:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It's also important to use context

Brooks played through some pitcher-dominated years in the late 1960s, at the end of his prime. From age 27 to 34 (1964-1971), he had OPS+ of: 145, 124, 123, 124, 116, 92 (and that was 1969, when the O’s were 109-53, so I don’t think he hurt them), 109, and 114. Offensively, he still doesn’t compare to Schmidt or Brett, but defensively he has no peer. I’m just saying that his .268 average is a little more solid than it seems in 2009.

"The United States is the New York Yankees of countries...powerful and respected until the year 2000." - Homer J. Simpson

by Brotz13 on May 13, 2009 9:02 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

You almost need to adjust for inflation

Especially prior to 1969, when they adjusted the height of the mound. Nobody was batting .320 in 1968.

Brooks’ .258 average in 1968 was actually the 22nd HIGHEST average in the AL that year.

The leader? Yaz, with a hefty .302. No one else broke .290. Not one other American League player batted over .290 for the season. Makes that .258 look a little different, huh?

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/yearly/top25.php?s=BAVG&l=AL&y=1968

Matt Wieters took batting practice this morning. There were no survivors.

by duck on May 13, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

right, but...

isn’t that the point of OPS+?

"If they pitch to you, make them pay."

--Diamond Dave to the Phenom

by j.q. higgins on May 13, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I suppose it is...

Matt Wieters took batting practice this morning. There were no survivors.

by duck on May 13, 2009 12:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

More context?

I think I remember reading once that when Brooks retired 268 was the career high for homers by a 3B? Schmidt blew it away a blink later, but if I have that right it’s another symbol of what a different offensive era we’re talking about.

Has there ever been a cooler Oriole than Eddie Murray? I mean, just straight up cool. Like a bad, suave dude. You know what I'm sayin'. COOL. SC 7/24/08

by 33 on May 13, 2009 10:55 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

He was probably high on the list

But I’m assuming Eddie Mathews topped him easily. Still, as you say, 268 homers at 3B in the 1950s-1970s is a big number. I personally thought it was cool that his batting average and HR total were the same number.

"The United States is the New York Yankees of countries...powerful and respected until the year 2000." - Homer J. Simpson

by Brotz13 on May 13, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Now I "remember"

Amazing how looking around on baseball-reference and baseball-almanac helps you ‘remember.’
It was career by an AL 3B. Even now that mark is not much higher — 319 by Graig Nettles.

My first thought was that Eddie M hit some as an OF and 1B, but clearly not enough to bridge the gap between 512 and 268.

Thanks, Brotz

Has there ever been a cooler Oriole than Eddie Murray? I mean, just straight up cool. Like a bad, suave dude. You know what I'm sayin'. COOL. SC 7/24/08

by 33 on May 13, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i get the feeling that...

because he played 16 seasons that has helped him out alot

by jsmall404 on May 13, 2009 3:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Brooks was great

A few things to consider. First, Brooks was a MVP in 1964 and he finished in the top 5 in MVP voting 5 years, I believe. Second, batting averages were lower then. I believe that in 1968 or thereabouts Yaz won the batting crown with a BA slightly over 300. Ditto with home runs. Brooks averaged 20 home runs from 1964 to 1971 when 20 was a lot. Finally, statistics simply don’t describe how superb Brooks was in the field. You had to see it to believe it. He was unworldly.

by BaltoBen on May 13, 2009 3:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

See above for relevant stats

1968 – Yaz led the league with .302, no one else broke .290. Brooks was 22nd in batting in the AL that year.

Matt Wieters took batting practice this morning. There were no survivors.

by duck on May 13, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

prostate cancer

has anyone seen this?

http://wjz.com/local/brooks.robinson.prostate.2.1007954.html

by jsmall404 on May 13, 2009 3:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

yep. sucks.

"If they pitch to you, make them pay."

--Diamond Dave to the Phenom

by j.q. higgins on May 13, 2009 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He was

the best at what he did for a very long time.
That’s why he is in the Hall of Fame.
He was the Lebron James of 3B, the Tiger Woods in the field, and he could get you a clutch hit, or big homer, now and then.
He wan’t fast – he wasn’t super athletic – but he was a GREAT third baseman.
Besides that, he signed my ball on my birthday when I was 8 years old – and it still sits on my shelf today 42 years later.
He was – and still is – my hero.

There's no crying in baseball

by elktonfan on May 13, 2009 8:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

lebron james?

Brooks won that one MVP, and he had a great year (so did the Mick that year), but he wasn’t the consensus best player in the whole league like Lebron is/is going to be for the next bunch of years. Lebron James is currently like 23 or 24 years old. He’s gonna be great for a long time.

If you mean he was the Lebron James of defense at 3rd, well, sure, whatever. But Lebron is great at all facets of his game. Brooks was great at one and good at others.

by pipkin on May 13, 2009 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

ugh...

does that make him a less flamboyant (or however you call an utter lack of flamboyance) dennis rodman?

"If they pitch to you, make them pay."

--Diamond Dave to the Phenom

by j.q. higgins on May 14, 2009 12:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

maybe he's like mutumbo?

by pipkin on May 14, 2009 1:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

For the locals -

The Outside Pitch for the month of May has a “catching up with” Brooks Robinson. Pretty good write-up, with good quotes from Brooks. Apparently, the “rift” between the team and Brooks is due mostly to Brook’s quiet nature.

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by the fix is in on May 15, 2009 9:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs