Jones or Markakis?
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Jul 31, 2009 6:12 PM EDT
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PrintLet's say several years form now both Markakis' and Jones' contracts have expired, and we only have enough money to resign one of them, if you are Andy McPhail would do you resign AJ or Nick? Let's just say it's this off season to prevent speculation about how good Adam Jones and Nick Markakis will be several years from now.
Me, I would sign Dr. Jones.
Reason One- Stats
He is better the Markakis in these catergories
- Slugging %
- Batting Average
- Runs
- Home Runs
- On Base Percentage+Slugging Percentage
- On Base %
- Stolen Bases
And there's some sabermetric stats which also hepls my case
- Run Created Per 27 Outs
- Isolated Power
Reason Two- Adam is better in the clutch. These stats back it up:
- Average, RISP 2 Outs
- Slugging, RISP 2 Outs
- OPS, RISP 2 Outs
- Run Created Per 27 Outs, RISP 2 Outs
He's better then Nick in all those categories. You need clutchness and Adam has plenty of it!
Reason Three- AJ is a Yankee Killer
If you want to win in this division you most likely will go thorugh the Yankees and Adam is a better Yankee Killer then Nick, Stats:
- Batting Average
- Hits
- Doubles
- Slugging %
- On Base %
- OPS
In all of those categories AJ is better then Nick.
And from business stand point there's a good reason.
Reason Four- His personality, Adam has a personality that it easy to endorse "Come see the bubble blowing, home run hitting goofball that is Adam Jones!!!" And that would mean more people would pay money to see the man advertised, And more ticket sales means more money!
On the other hand Nick is kind of shy and not exactly outgoing, and I'm pretty sure that's hard to endorse.
So what do you think? Do you agree with me with that we should sign Jones if this scenario is to occur or do you disagree and you think we should sign Nick. Rather you agree or not, leave a comment telling me who you would sign.
Let's get some debate going!
FanPosts are user-created content and do not necessarily reflect the views of the editors of Camden Chat or SB Nation. They might, though.
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Both of them strikeout way too much, with that said Adam Jones has such a huge upside of power, stolen bases, average, RBI, etc. Markakis is good, but it’s really no debate you have to take Jones over Markakis, not to mention Jones is two years younger.
by No More Steroids Please on Jul 31, 2009 6:31 PM EDT reply actions
I personally think
they don’t strike out nearly enough. Just my opinion though.
Matt Wieters can get to the tootsie roll center of a tootsie pop in under one lick.
aj strikes out more
nick has struck out 69 times or once per 5.99 ABs
aj has struck out 80 times or once per 4.79 ABs
by twistedlogic on Aug 2, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions
nick always seems to K with RISP
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 10:55 AM EDT up reply actions
aj k's once every 6.66 ab's nick's k once every 6.1 ab's
It still feels like he strikes out more.
Maybe it’s just me.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:08 AM EDT up reply actions
where did you get those?
assuming those are correct, i guess it’s just you…..
by twistedlogic on Aug 2, 2009 11:09 AM EDT up reply actions
espn
those are risp totals, maybe risp 2 outs stats tell a diffrent story
http://espn.go.com/mlb/stats/batting/_/position/of/split/39/sort/strikeouts/qualified/false/minpa/25
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
ah cool
risp 2 outs and risp total shouldnt make any difference. a K with RISP 0-1 out and a K with RISP 2 outs is still a K with RISP
by twistedlogic on Aug 2, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
just curious?
were did you find that chubby phillies kid?
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
he was at one of the games we played against them
kept getting his big mouth on TV and somebody posted the screenshot from MLB tv in the gamethread, so i stole it. I owe my glorious avatar to whoever posted that…
by twistedlogic on Aug 2, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
great stuff
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions
i think he's yelling
get me another twinkie!
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions
that would be appropriate
although i doubt he’s asking for just one
by twistedlogic on Aug 2, 2009 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
get me
10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
twinkies!
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
phillies fans
are worse then MFY and PHN combined
i was at the game in 03 for WS 20th Anniversery, sat in front of 3 drunk Philly fans
worse expirence ever! haven’t gone to a phillies game since.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Nick has been striking out looking a whole lot recently
and no, I don’t have any numbers to support that, just the fact that I watch almost every Orioles game. So it seemed like he Ks more than AJ. But you’re right, AJ does strike out a fair amount now that I think about it… he chases bad pitches… work on that AJ!
i still dont get how it "seems" like nick k's more
considering nick has k’ed about 15 fewer times in about 30 more at-bats. i’m not saying that to start an argument or anything, i just dont get that. when somebody k’s looking, it seems like more k’s than when somebody strikes out swinging?
No you're right
By “seems,” I was just trying to convey that Nick has been striking out looking a lot (and often to end innings) and this has annoyed me personally, to the point where I did not notice that AJ has been striking out a lot too. Until I thought about it, and recalled that he’s been chasing bad pitches.
I’m definitely not looking to start an internet argument! :) Peace and Orioles love!!! Wooooo
it seems like he does
because people are more forgiving of AJ’s k’s because of his other numbers, whereas Nick has a lower average and less homers. So for instance if jones goes 2 for 5 with 3 k’s, but hits a 3 run homer, people are going to remember the homer, and forget the k’s. If Markakis goes 1 for 4 with 1 k, people will remember the strikeout.
Stop getting around the point
which is that he strikes out in more important situations. PERFECT EXAMPLE: tonights game at detroit: top of the ninth. Reimold gets hit by a pitch then Jones hits a 2 run bomb to left. What does Markakis do after that? he STRIKES OUT and kills the rally.
you have absolutely no proof that he strikes out more in important situations
sure he struck out to “end the rally” last nite, but that happens to everyone. PERFECT EXAMPLE: Markakis had an RBI single during Matusz’ start. What does Jones do after that? he GROUNDS INTO A DOUBLE PLAY and kills the rally.
not a strike out, but i’d rather have a K than a GIDP
Once again getting around the point
We were only talking about STRIKEOUTS. Not double plays, regardless of what you would rather have. Also, we actually WON Matusz’ start, and we LOST last night, so your example was most certainly NOT a perfect one, seeing as it doesnt even refer to the type of play we are talking about. Dont get me wrong, i love Markakis, im just tring to provide an answer for why many people say it seems like he strikes out more than jones.
Oh, and another thing,
Jones’ GIDP followed a Markakis single in the TOP OF THE FIRST INNING. Detroit hadn’t even batted yet, so how can you say that Jones’ GIDP “killed the rally”? What Rally? we were already up 1 to 0, in the FIRST INNING, and they hadn’t even batted yet!
im sorry but....
this will probably never happen, my two cents is that they will both be in Baltimore forever. However i think that we all know that Jones is better.
Get out the rye bread and mustard grandma, cause it's GRAND SALAMI TIME!
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 31, 2009 6:35 PM EDT reply actions
What a horrible thought.
Even as a hypothetical! I’m sad now.
Just because you know how to read, doesn't mean you'll like the book.
Isn't this kind of like asking
Which leg would you rather cut off?
by wishEYEhadCRABS on Jul 31, 2009 6:43 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
i know the thought of this is terrible
but please take a side and state your case.
Good Luck in LA George and Welcome To Baltimore Josh and Steve.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Jul 31, 2009 7:20 PM EDT reply actions
AJ isn't "better than Nick" in all your categories
Sure, he has posted better numbers this season, but Adam went on an amazing tear while Nick slumped for quite a bit. The statistics will level out by September.
I think that Nick will likely finish his career with a higher OBP and AVG than Jones, while Adam beats Markakis out with HR and SLG numbers.
Personally, I’d take Markakis everyday of the week and twice on Sunday.
"There's only one cure for what's wrong with all of us pitchers, and that's to take a year off. Then, after you've gone a year without throwing, quit altogether." -Jim Palmer
Wait. . .
Nick’s line is currently .298/.352/.467, while Adam’s is .296/.351/.492, so Markakis is actually “better than” Jones in AVG/SLG by your criteria.
I’m going to go ahead and assume that your post was made before tonight’s game, and Nick’s current 2 for 3 has propelled him past AJ.
"There's only one cure for what's wrong with all of us pitchers, and that's to take a year off. Then, after you've gone a year without throwing, quit altogether." -Jim Palmer
Triple post!
Nick has scored virtually the same amount of runs in 2009, and will almost certainly always have a better K/BB ratio than AJ.
"There's only one cure for what's wrong with all of us pitchers, and that's to take a year off. Then, after you've gone a year without throwing, quit altogether." -Jim Palmer
Once upon a time
there was a guy that was the face of the organization. He wasn’t all that vocal. He had to be sometimes, though, and when he spoke he said all the right things. He went out there every day and busted his butt. He didn’t complain about anything, he didn’t get into trouble, and he was a great role model to anyone looking for one. All he did was deliver consistent numbers year in and year out, do his job every day with a quiet confidence, and bring pride to the city of Baltimore and Orioles fans everywhere. He may not have been a loud, rah-rah leader type, and he may not have had the most “fun” personality, but he was everything good about the Baltimore Orioles. His name (if you havent guessed it yet) was Calvin Edwin Ripken, Jr.
I love AJ’s personality and all, but a guy doesn’t have to be that way to be the face of a franchise. Sometimes doing your job well day in and day out and going about it quietly and respectfully can speak volumes to a fanbase too.
/end defense of my mancrush for Nick
Matt Wieters can get to the tootsie roll center of a tootsie pop in under one lick.
by daveh873 on Jul 31, 2009 11:59 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
i knew a cal ripken nick markakis comparison was coming
Good Luck in LA George and Welcome To Baltimore Josh and Steve.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 1, 2009 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions
+1 Dave for that
"You don't EVEN KNOW who Nick Markakis is"- .....My 4 year old daughter to another kid.
"I'm a Country Boy"- ......Alan Jackson
another point for AJ
He appreciates the fans and people of Baltimore he’s proud to be playing in Baltimore.
For Example- He was excited that he got to wear the Baltimore uni in the all-star game.
He realizes that this is a city that has a storied baseball tradition and wants to be a part of it. How can you say no that.
Good Luck in LA George and Welcome To Baltimore Josh and Steve.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 1, 2009 10:23 AM EDT reply actions
This is a ridiculous question to ask, therefore I refuse to answer.
"He's a gazelle." -Adam Jones on Nolan Reimold.
it's hypofetical!!! (sp)
Good Luck in LA George and Welcome To Baltimore Josh and Steve.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 1, 2009 5:28 PM EDT up reply actions
Hypothetical.
And it doesn’t mean I want to answer. I don’t want to see either of them be gone, or think about it. With the two of them (and Reimold) we have one of the best and youngest outfields in baseball. Both of them are extremely valuable and bring something of their own to the table.
"He's a gazelle." -Adam Jones on Nolan Reimold.
What's the point of talking/thinking about this?
It will obviously depend on how they both do over the next 4-5 years, how the team does, and the financial situation.
let's say its this offseason
i do mention it in the post at the top.
Good Luck in LA George and Welcome To Baltimore Josh and Steve.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 1, 2009 11:25 PM EDT up reply actions
There isn't enough wrong in the world
so why not have some more and pile some more bad thoughts into everyone’s head.
What up?
well i'm trying to make you think nick leaving isn't so bad.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 8:02 AM EDT up reply actions
I would like to clear something up
I was forced to take a side!
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 9:17 AM EDT up reply actions
read below
stacey
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 10:56 AM EDT up reply actions
either one of them leaving would be awful,
i’m trying to say if Nick left it would a tiny bit less awful then if Adam left.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn't say. How many years are you basing this off of? One? Perhaps AJ will end up slightly more valuable offensively, but I think Nick will end up being better defensively.I think they will end up being very similar, but AJ having more power.
And how were YOU forced to pick a side? You made the fanpost!
"He's a gazelle." -Adam Jones on Nolan Reimold.
stacey
she wanted me to pick a side on the matter, and i’m not going to ignore a CC mod.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 9:57 AM EDT up reply actions
this is probably where i'd use disgression
and just not post
by twistedlogic on Aug 2, 2009 10:57 AM EDT up reply actions
oh are you kidding me?
You’re trying to throw me under the bus because people are picking apart your fan post?
Well then I’ll throw you under the bus. You wanted to post a question, “Who would you rather sign, Nick or AJ?” and put up a poll or have people discuss or something. I told you that if you wanted to explore who is better, Nick or AJ, you better be prepared to take a stance and back it up with statistics. It’s not my fault people don’t like what you have to say.
And I warned you about two things: 1) clutch, and 2) personality.
I will lead these Peoples to the promised land, also known as "Slightly Ahead of the Blue Jays." ~WietersRunDry
i'm not blaming you
i’m sorry if i gave you the impression i was
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Nick not outgoing?
Im pretty sure Nick is hosting a 5K and funrun with his wife sometime soon.
www.snaorioles.com
Nick is extremely outgoing. With the people he knows. He's shy in public.
"He's a gazelle." -Adam Jones on Nolan Reimold.
what i mean is that adam is outgoing in public.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 2, 2009 9:16 AM EDT up reply actions
Read lots of articles. Read once he likes to bike through the clubhouse naked (I think it was in the Washington Post). Also all of his juggling acts, stuff on his chin... oh, and the heely fad he started last year among the O's.
"He's a gazelle." -Adam Jones on Nolan Reimold.
the biking part is sorta disturbing
he also has a charity for homeless kids. community awareness. well played nicky
This is actually a solid fanpost
Nobody’s said it yet but this is much improved from your previous fanposts.
To choose a side I would go Markakis any day of the week. Jones has a higher ceiling in terms of power and defensive ability but Markakis is proven over several years. Which brings me to my next point and that is sample size. Your argument about “Yankee killer” relies on a small sample size (and so does the “clutch” one for that matter). Small statistical sample sizes dont really tell you anything. I would take Markakis and his insanely high OBP but thankfully we dont have to choose.
"I have seen the future and his name is Matt Wieters." Keith Law
thank you redd!
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 3, 2009 8:16 AM EDT up reply actions
i was going to argue the same thing reddrummer
but i was attempting to avoid arguing with anybody :-)
thank twisted
I’m glad to hear that my fellow CC’ers are starting to like my work.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 3, 2009 8:30 AM EDT up reply actions
both
I’ll take both
"The key to winning baseball games is pitching, fundamentals, and three run homers."
what scary is that i don't think AJ has hit his prime
And he’s already has been to the All-Star game, so you would assume that AJ has more good years left then Nick. Key word is assume!
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 3, 2009 8:18 AM EDT reply actions
i KNEW that was coming.
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 3, 2009 8:30 AM EDT up reply actions
i figured you would bring it up
"Hey ump, how about a warning? Sure. Watch out you don't get killed". -Moonlight Graham talking to an umpire after two straight pitches at his head
by BaltimoreSportsFan on Aug 3, 2009 8:31 AM EDT up reply actions
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