Wednesday Bird Droppings

by zknower on Sep 9, 2009 5:45 AM EDT in Open Threads Comment 66 comments

I don't want to use a picture of last night's game. So here's some BriBob eye candy instead. (AP Photo/Gail Burton)

Jones, Bergesen go on Orioles' DL - UPI.com
Baltimore Orioles outfielder Adam Jones went on the 15-day disabled list Tuesday and pitcher Brad Bergesen was put on the 60-day DL. Baltimore also called up five players from Class AAA Norfolk.

Rating AL's top rookies - SweetSpot by Rob Neyer - ESPN
Rob Neyer doesn't think Nolan Reimold deserves any RoY votes.

Your 2009 (and 2008, ‘07, ‘06 …) Pittsburgh Pirates - 2nd & Short - Mark McGuire, timesunion.com - Albany NY
A depressing column about the Orioles NL counterpart. Some nice comments about the O's at the bottom by Pirates fans.

Babe Ruth Museum Celebrates Brooks Robinson - ABC News
Babe Ruth Museum celebrates Brooks Robinson at an annual Gala.

MLB.com At Bat 2009 app expanding | MLB.com: News
iPhone and iPod touch users without an MLB.tv subscription can now watch games on demand for 99 cents per game.

Turner's excitement about reaching majors is 'indescribable' -- baltimoresun.com
Justin Turner savors his first trip to the majors. And good news, Trembley describes him as "a grinder, a blue-collar guy...a gamer."

Eastern League Announces Weekly Award Winners - OurSports Central
Steve Johnson, a right-handed starting pitcher for the Bowie Baysox, is the Eastern League Pitcher of the Week for the week ending September 7th. The 6'1", 200 lb. hurler made a pair of starts for the Baysox last week and was 2-0 with 14 strikeouts and a 1.42 ERA in 12.2 innings pitched.

Scout.com: Tony Butler Q & A
An update on Tony Butler, the forgotten man in the Erik Bedard trade.

Widlansky wins Carolina League batting title - MASNsports.com
1B/OF Robbie Widlansky won the Carolina League batting title, the third Key in 2009 to be recognized by the league (Zach Britton was named Pitcher of the Year and Brandon Waring won MVP).

This is the Open Thread you could be saving if you switched to GEICO.

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So...

Rob Neyer is a moron.

Nice to see Steve Johnson dominating and getting some recognition though!

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 8:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Do you wonder what MacPhail really thinks when he watches this team?

I wonder if he thinks there is a good chance to compete in their division at some point in the the next several years. Or does he think it’s a long shot, but he may as well keep plugging away? I figure he knows, in general, the amount of money the O’s plan to spend in the next several years. That will influence the chances of picking up a strong bat or a front line pitcher.

Now that this season is not worth watching, we’ll need to wait for the off season. I expect the O’s to inch along and “plan” for 2011 while the youth “develops” in 2010.

by drj on Sep 9, 2009 9:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Tampa Bay Rays 2007 v 2008

Crazier things have happened. Build a solid foundation, and go from there…

by Y Not on Sep 9, 2009 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It remains to be seen if the Rays are a one hit wonder, or if they will return to contention. Build a base and all that is fine, but the Yankees and Red Sox do that plus buy the best available in addition.

I just wonder if MacPhail goes to work believing he can assemble a team that can compete or if he’s just thinking he’ll give it the college try.

by drj on Sep 9, 2009 6:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It remains to be seen if the Rays are a one hit wonder, or if they will return to contention.

I think this year suggests that they’re not a one hit wonder. Until last week, they were in the thick of the playoff race.

"You don’t EVEN KNOW who birdman is!"

by birdman on Sep 9, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

and their run differential remains excellent

by pipkin on Sep 9, 2009 8:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

They are sitting home in October. They traded a pitcher they recently signed to a good contract because they say they can’t afford him. Their owner says thy will continue to cycle through players in exchange for youth. We’ve seen stuff like this with the Twins. We’ll see if it flies in the AL East battling against two very rich teams. Sitting home in October isn’t my idea of a good year.

This is a side issue as the Rays situation is not the O’s. I’d just like to be a fly on the wall and hear what MacPhail thinks the real odds are of the O’s putting together a team that can make the playoffs (and not just once).

by drj on Sep 9, 2009 8:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Seems like a fucking AWESOME year from where I'm sitting.

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Looks like Rob Neyer

just got a beat down from a Mr William Duck.

by daveh873 on Sep 9, 2009 9:44 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Nice!

I wonder if I can bill Jeff Lurie and Peter Angelos for the years of therapy their teams are going to put me through.

by BrianS on Sep 9, 2009 10:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Not my best effort...

but I had to stick up for my avatar!

Jim Palmer: "I said to Nolan, 'Why do you run every ball out like that?' and he said, 'Why wouldn’t you?' "

by duck on Sep 9, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Andrus does deserve the award

But Neyer overreached in saying Reimold doesn’t deserve any votes at all. But, like, third place in the RoY voting is pretty silly to even care about, so whatever.

It hardly makes him a moron. The man has been writing very good things about baseball for a very long time, now.

by pipkin on Sep 9, 2009 9:49 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

ummm

disagree

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Calling FJM

This is pure moronosity:

Yes, that hardly qualifies as analysis.

I agree 1000%, sir

But if you do the actual analysis, the answer’s the same: Andrus is the best rookie in the American League due to his playing time and his defense.

I’d like to see this analysis. It must be the same as the analysis that voted Troy Tulowitki the ROY a few years back, since playing time and defense are #1 on everyone’s list. Nobody cares about being good at hitting baseballs anymore.

And (sorry, Sox fans) it’s not close. If the voters are paying any sort of attention at all, Andrus should get a bunch of first-place votes and those other guys shouldn’t get any at all.

Was there another candidate? Oh, well I ranked him last in defense, for some reason that I’m not divulging. It’s proprietary analysis, you see. I don’t even know what team he played for, and if I don’t know, then nobody else must care about him.

"I hate seeing Bedard go, but I think the O's may have gotten the better end of the deal" -- me, 2/8/08

by CoachOfEarl on Sep 9, 2009 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

lol +1,000,000

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hrm

Let’s be totally fair. Ignoring pitchers…all three of these guys are having good seasons, and most organizations would be thrilled to have any of them. Elvis Andrus plays a terrifyingly terrific shortstop – he’s top 2 in baseball defensively, while Beckham and Reimold play less than inspiring corner positions where the hitting means more than the defense. It really, really isn’t close to who is the best defensive player of the three.

On the offensive side of things, Andrus has a .334 wOBA in 443 plate appearances compared to Reimold with .363 in 385 and Beckham with .350 in 341. So there’s a gap in the offensive side, but is it really large enough to account for the huge defensive gap?

Hard to say, really. But, FYI, when it comes to WARP, Reimold has 1.3, Beckham 1.9, and Andrus 3.1, far and away the best of the three – and it really, really isn’t close.

So cut my man Rob some slack.

Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racing's important to men who do it well. When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting.

by Andrew @ TLC on Sep 9, 2009 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

These damn newfangled statistics!

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Andrus should be the favorite

But I just don’t think it’s as clear cut as he says. Plus he totally didn’t mention Brett Anderson or Brad Bergesen, both of whom I think should be higher on the list than Reimold or Beckham. Although Bergesen loses points for being injured, and maybe I just read too much FanGraphs which makes me like Anderson.

Earl Weaver would’ve kissed Adam Dunn on the mouth in public. - SC 08/11/08

by Stacey on Sep 9, 2009 2:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Well, yeah, pitchers were omitted

But I can sort of understand the thinking that an everyday player is almost always more valuable than a pitcher…but for sure Bergesen, Romero, Porcello, Bailey, etc. etc. all really deserve some mention.

Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racing's important to men who do it well. When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting.

by Andrew @ TLC on Sep 9, 2009 2:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He mentioned Romero, Porcello, Niemann

after he talked about hitters.

Earl Weaver would’ve kissed Adam Dunn on the mouth in public. - SC 08/11/08

by Stacey on Sep 9, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

LIke I said in the ROY FP

I think it’ll probably go to a pitcher this year, Niemann or Bailey. Too bad Bergy got knocked out by stupid Billy Butler.

Reimold is clearly the best rookie at the plate, and I think his defense is somewhat unfairly dissed by SSS UZR, which feeds into any WAR argument. Please stop using those stats for rookies, there is not enough data. And his 5 outfield assists show that he’s got some value in the field.

I think the writers are doing Nolan and Baltimore a great disservice by writing him off like they are. I’m not saying he’s a clear cut winner.

"I hate seeing Bedard go, but I think the O's may have gotten the better end of the deal" -- me, 2/8/08

by CoachOfEarl on Sep 9, 2009 3:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Please stop using those stats for rookies, there is not enough data. And his 5 outfield assists show that he’s got some value in the field.

I think it’s fair to look at them but I wouldn’t assign a lot of importance to them. At this point, the amount of defensive data for each of the ROY candidates equates to about a month of hitting stats. If that’s all the data you have, oh well, but let’s not get carried away. We should assign more importance to hitting stats and then adjust by position.

"You don’t EVEN KNOW who birdman is!"

by birdman on Sep 9, 2009 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Small Sample Sizes

Done in by my own favorite counter argument! Crap!

But okay, even if we do adjust for position, I think the offense comes out really close since Andrus hits about average or so for a shortstop and Reimold hits well for a left fielder…but not THAT well. I mean, when I think of left fielders, I think of Barry Bonds and Johnny Damon and Jason Bay and ManRam and Matt Holliday and big time sluggers like that.

I think Reimold has a very good chance to become that kind of hitter, but he isn’t there yet…but if Andrus stayed at his current level of hitting prowess throughout his career, I’d have to believe 30 teams out of the league would take that from shortstop (given a certain level of glovework…and small sample size or not, Andrus has a very strong defensive reputation which has so far been justified and will probably affect the voting substantially)

Lotta people go through life doing things badly. Racing's important to men who do it well. When you're racing, it's life. Anything that happens before or after is just waiting.

by Andrew @ TLC on Sep 9, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Reimold has the potential for that level of hitting

He put up a .750 SLG in AAA. He’s showing plate discipline beyond his experience level. He is currently leading this team and all rookies in OPS. And as far as defense goes, I think most of his errors were made early on. He’s still adjusting to the position. I’d like to see him at 1B, but I’m getting off topic.

I’m a big fan of defense, so I’m not trying to completely diss Elvis. Hell, I threw a bunch of ASG votes his way. But I’d rather have Reimold on my team because gold glove SS are cheap on the market (now, anyway) and big bats are expensive, so I wouldn’t trade Reimold for Andrus.

And the whole Tulo vs Braun debate was very similar, but Tulo was a better hitter than Andrus, and Brawn was a better hitter than Reimold. Brawn won.

It’s a tough choice as far as voting. My whole point is that too many people are throwing Reimold out for reasons (I feel) they don’t understand, as Neyer so poorly wrote.

"I hate seeing Bedard go, but I think the O's may have gotten the better end of the deal" -- me, 2/8/08

by CoachOfEarl on Sep 9, 2009 4:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

My whole point is that too many people are throwing Reimold out for reasons (I feel) they don’t understand, as Neyer so poorly wrote.

Who are these people and what don’t they understand?

"You don’t EVEN KNOW who birdman is!"

by birdman on Sep 9, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

It's too bad for Beckham he's not in the middle where he belongs

Then his defensive value would be higher and he might give Andrus a run for his money.

by pipkin on Sep 9, 2009 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

lies, damnable lies and statistics

A baseball game is simply a nervous breakdown divided into nine innings. - Earl Wilson

by col_kl1nk on Sep 9, 2009 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I thought you folks would enjoy this...

I was reading over at Big Blue View (the SBN Giants blog) and found this jem. Now, i’m not nearly as well known over there, so I couldn’t just call this guy out, but WOW. Enjoy! (BTW, his handle is “nycity”. Just goes to show the difference b/t a NJ Giants fan and an nyc Giants fan)

Great interview ed… I think the redskins have a lot of problems.. first off they lack leadership on offense…. they tried there best to trade there qb for a rookie and it didn’t happen… portis and zorn don’t like each other and there OL looks shaky… and if anything was to happen to there 100 million dollar man on defense then things can get very ugly in washington….

by daveh873 on Sep 9, 2009 10:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I don’t know that I’ve ever seen “their” and “there” confused so many times in a single place before.

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

i'm really going to enjoy the regression of the jints this season.

"I think my motivation is to see the other guys in the clubhouse. They’re contending for the playoffs, and when I see that it gets into my body. I play like it’s the playoffs too" —Memlo

by zknower on Sep 9, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

good luck with that

by daveh873 on Sep 9, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

so bergesen's done for the year

by twistedlogic on Sep 9, 2009 10:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Apparently David Hernandez is too

cough cough bullpen cough

by sickuvitall on Sep 9, 2009 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

so we're taking berken over hernandez at this point?

no peeking at his start tonight..

"you know what the orioles could use right now? a day off." - joe angel

by swilhelmross on Sep 9, 2009 12:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

its not pretty any way you look it

but i feel like berken has pitched slightly better of late whereas hernandez has not

by twistedlogic on Sep 9, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I also think Hernandez can elevate his game with a move to the bullpen

Berken probably is what he is, regardless of where he’s pitching

by kba26 on Sep 9, 2009 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yea i doubt berken is gonna be any better than he is now

which is sorta unfortunate, but who knows? he actually looked halfway decent again minus the fact that he followed hernandez to the dark side and gave up a whole bunch of walks.

by twistedlogic on Sep 9, 2009 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I don’t think those Lansdowne street shots would be any more fun to watch if they came from the bullpen. Just sayin…

You don't EVEN KNOW who O's21girl is!

by Senatorrosewater on Sep 9, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I see I missed some very active debate while I was at the gym...

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 12:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

WTF

City police arrest 4 in theft of Ripken’s No. 8 statue

I hope this wasn’t posted somewhere already. But either way, I repeat: WTF?

by O Nina on Sep 9, 2009 12:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

bunch of morons

but more importantly, why wasn’t it made out of something more sturdy than hollow aluminum???

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Goes to show you looks are deceiving

I’ll grant I never got up close and personal with the numbers, but for some reason I always thought they were all made out of something heavy like stone or concrete or something.

Aluminum, really? Talk about dispelling the magic!

Cry havoc and unleash the Esskay hot dogs of war! - The Wayward Oriole, Opening Day 2008

by Eat More Esskay on Sep 9, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yeah I thought they were concrete actually - never been that close to them.

It seems like if they’re metal they should be iron or something heavy.

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

My friends and stood on top of them once

and took pictures. It was like 2 a.m. and we were drunk. When we were taking pictures in front of them we appeared to be the only people around, but as soon as I stood on the 20 a security guard came out of nowhere and chased us away. So maybe they’re aluminum but they’re at least strong enough to hold my weight long enough for me to get my picture take and then jump off quickly and run away from the security dude.

Earl Weaver would’ve kissed Adam Dunn on the mouth in public. - SC 08/11/08

by Stacey on Sep 9, 2009 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think you have to post the picture now.

sounds like a good night!

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

heh

I’ll see what I can do. I think my friend might have them posted on Facebook.

Earl Weaver would’ve kissed Adam Dunn on the mouth in public. - SC 08/11/08

by Stacey on Sep 9, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

LOL…that’s awesome.

I wonder if I can bill Jeff Lurie and Peter Angelos for the years of therapy their teams are going to put me through.

by BrianS on Sep 9, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Really!!

I’m sorry, I used to really love this team. From as long as I can remember I have rooted for this franchise and all of the class players. Does P.A. want to be the owner of a loseing franchise or does he have some hidden hate for the fans of this team. I am all for the future and bringing up the kids to play and develop, but come on. Let’s stop trading away the talient because it costs too much to keep them. Give me something to root for and give me a reason to come to Camden Yards besides the crab cakes and Boogs BBQ. 1983 was a long time ago.

by mrkk270 on Sep 9, 2009 12:58 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

the taliented mr huff, bedard, or who?

you can still go to the yard to see wiggy if no one else

"you know what the orioles could use right now? a day off." - joe angel

by swilhelmross on Sep 9, 2009 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Hey...

is this ‘shernorioles’ from the MLB boards? Sure sounds like the same bitter rhetoric….

by NewYorkOriole on Sep 9, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Exactly what was the "talient" getting us before we traded them away?

Try to have a little more subtle understanding of the way a baseball team rebuilds. If you don’t think the trades that have been made over the last 2 years have made the O’s a better team going forwards you’re crazy.

by O'sFan21 on Sep 9, 2009 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

If the voters are paying any sort of attention at all, Andrus should get a bunch of first-place votes and those other guys shouldn’t get any at all.

I think Neyer misspoke a bit here. I think he means that the other candidates should not receive any first place votes, not that Elvis should get every single vote. If you believe a certain candidate is a heads and shoulder over everybody else, then it’s a defensible position. Now whether Elvis is indeed the clear first choice is another matter.

"You don’t EVEN KNOW who birdman is!"

by birdman on Sep 9, 2009 1:01 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

oh, yeah, duh

you’ve got to be right. It’s an awkwardly-worded sentence that can certainly be read either way. And I think you got it right, while the rest of us (or at least I) didn’t.

by pipkin on Sep 9, 2009 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I’ve got to admit that I have a soft spot for Neyer. I love his work and him personally (not that I know I him personally). Unfortunately, since he switched over to a blog, he’s obligated to write 3 or 4 postings a day which has diluted his work.

"You don’t EVEN KNOW who birdman is!"

by birdman on Sep 9, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Yes, I think you're right

He seems, lately, to have actually based a lot more of his judgments on gut and observation, which is something he really never did before.

Filling space on a blog has gotta be tough. I admire that he’s doing it right, with several posts a day. But there’s only so much going on, and I suppose the echo chamber that is the baseball blogosphere can often lead one to make unfounded statements.

That was basically a longwided way of saying I noticed the same thing. But I still think I like him as a blogger. A three-times-a-week columnist isn’t enough Neyer.

by pipkin on Sep 9, 2009 4:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

He seems, lately, to have actually based a lot more of his judgments on gut and observation, which is something he really never did before.

I just think he’s gotten sloppy lately. Overall though, I still dig him.

"You don’t EVEN KNOW who birdman is!"

by birdman on Sep 9, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

am i the only who noticed stacey is now cobra commander?

are am i slow to notice?

Ray Rice is so agile. He's a whole new breed for agile you need a new word to describe his agility... UBER-AGILITY!

by BaltimoreSportsFan on Sep 9, 2009 5:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

its been a slow coup

by kba26 on Sep 9, 2009 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Both she and SC are listed

It remains to be seen if it’s a Destro/Cobra Commander or a Serpentor/Cobra Commander relationship.

by Gorilla Bird on Sep 9, 2009 5:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

whaaa!?

2 Cobra Commanders?!

There can only be one!

by daveh873 on Sep 9, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

also...

shouldnt the crimson guard be higher ranked than the dreadnoks?

by daveh873 on Sep 9, 2009 5:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

not until the crimson guard can pry this keyboard from my cold, dead fingers.

"I think my motivation is to see the other guys in the clubhouse. They’re contending for the playoffs, and when I see that it gets into my body. I play like it’s the playoffs too" —Memlo

by zknower on Sep 9, 2009 5:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

no, you misunderstand...

the names alone should be reversed, meaning you’d become a crimson guardian (which would be the new 1st rank behind cobra commander). I just seem to remember dreadnoks being kinda lame in the cartoon and crimson guard being the elite soldiers of cobra. then again, I was never much of a gi joe fan.

by daveh873 on Sep 9, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs