Tuesday Bird Droppings
by duck on May 4, 2010 7:25 AM EDT
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If you really want to read about last night's rather pedestrian loss, you can at The Sun, Daily News, Steve Melewski, and MLB.com.
One bad inning does spoil the whole bunch - MASNsports.com
Video from last night's post-game interview with Dave Trembley. -duck
Banged-up Yankees KO Orioles; Posada, Mariano hurt - NYPOST.com
The Yankees may be without the services of catcher Jorge Posada and reliever Mariano Rivera for another day or two. -duck
Uehara won't rejoin O's before Thursday | MLB.com: News
Koji Uehara may join the team in Minneapolis, but he won't in New York. -duck
Slumping Scott has 'tried everything' - Baltimore Sun
Luke Scott has an idea about what's ailing him in the batter's box, but still can't fix it. -duck
Orioles Insider: Live chat with Orioles editor Steve Gould
Starts at noon, if you're interested. -duck
Orioles Insider: Minor league game recaps - May 3
Norfolk lost, Bowie won, Frederick won, and the Shorebirds won in 13 innings. -duck
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still
cuthrie is no mike mustina
"The United States is the New York Yankees of countries...powerful and respected until the year 2000." - Homer J. Simpson
But
He’s still way better than Brady Begerson has been.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 8:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Love the avatar, dude :)
"Oh, and Joe? If Brian hits any of your delicate millionaires, know that he meant it." - Stacey
Wanna make a signature line bet for tonights game?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 8:50 AM EDT up reply actions
I won't be around for a lot of it
Softball practice with the daughter, then a new LOST at 9. I know, it’s Matusz, so I’d take the under anyway.
"Oh, and Joe? If Brian hits any of your delicate millionaires, know that he meant it." - Stacey
i like how
atkins is on this team becasue he can hit CC. but does it make a difference when no one else can? its similar to keeping Albers on the team because he can strike out ortiz. oh well. the kid is on the mound tonight.
Sweet ass avatar
You could have also made one with Guts face on it. I’m sure thats what Girardi sees.
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
Anyone ever sit in the terrace boxes on the left field side?
Like, section 59. How is it? I found cheap tix on stubhub for that spot.
"Real Orioles don't pout. Real Orioles don't gloat. Real Orioles just win."
Those aren't my favorite
I don’t like being under the overhang, though.
Sometimes I just want to talk about beer, blowjobs and baseball, y’know? -2632
Seems like a pretty good view.....
based on the seat view thing on the Orioles website. How bad is the overhang? Does it block you from seeing fly balls and such?
"Real Orioles don't pout. Real Orioles don't gloat. Real Orioles just win."
by NewYorkOriole on May 4, 2010 9:16 AM EDT up reply actions
i sat there once
and i felt like it did…its a nice view of the field and thats about it
It’s the Ric Flair Theory of baseball – To be the man, you gotta beat the man. -duck
by Parkinglotninja on May 4, 2010 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions
yeah sometimes you lose pop ups and fly balls
and if it’s a hot game the air can get pretty stagnant under there, not much breeze
Sometimes I just want to talk about beer, blowjobs and baseball, y’know? -2632
Gotcha
Well, i got ‘em anyway. It’s versus the Indians, so we should be able to move down….
I’ve only ever sat way up in the upper deck, so it’ll be cool to be a little bit closer to the field….
"Real Orioles don't pout. Real Orioles don't gloat. Real Orioles just win."
by NewYorkOriole on May 4, 2010 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions
I'd rather get upper deck seats than under-the-overhang seats
Baseball under a blue sky, come on!
BUUUT, it is nice to have a legitimate ticket to the lower bowl, so if they check tickets, they don’t point towards the elevator (although most ushers just want you out of their section).
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on May 4, 2010 1:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh man
According to my calculations, it’ll be Guthrie pitching….(sigh)
"Real Orioles don't pout. Real Orioles don't gloat. Real Orioles just win."
by NewYorkOriole on May 4, 2010 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Outside of Matusz
is there anyone you’d really rather see a whole lot more? Berg still scares me a bit, Hernandez isn’t anything special, and Millwood is good, but not particularly any more exciting than Guts. He’s had one real bad outing this year and it was against the Yankees lineup. Give him a chance.
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
Every baseball game is unique
and has never happened before.
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on May 4, 2010 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
IT IS OUR HONOR TO WATCH AND RECORD THIS UNIQUE EVENT
-scorekeeper’s creed.
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on May 4, 2010 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
ha
I always keep score at baseball games. I used to use Strat-o-matic game sheets, now I found a nice downloadable scoresheet with more room….
"Real Orioles don't pout. Real Orioles don't gloat. Real Orioles just win."
by NewYorkOriole on May 4, 2010 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I was an Outside Pitch guy
But now they changed it to “Orioles Kids Scorecard” , which I thought was kind of demeaning, so I pasted bunch of old Outside Pitch graphics and stuff to cover up the “Oriole’s Kids” part, and ran like 100 color copies.
I just miss the Outside Pitch guy. When I got my Oriole tattoo, I showed it to him and he took me around to meet some of his vendors friend and he kept on saying “check THIS ONE out!” and they was all like “thats the best Orioles tattoo we’ve seen”
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on May 4, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I used "outside pitch guy" two different ways there...
in the subject, I’m trying to say “I used to always buy an outside pitch”
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on May 4, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not a big fan of the overhang
If you’re in one of the first few rows you’re probably alright. Farther back in the section and the only advantage you can say for it is that you can stay dry when there’s a rain delay.
I'm ready for a straight jacket. - Joe Angel, 4/17/10 (O's record: 1-11)
by Eat More Esskay on May 4, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
It's row 10....
not sure where that is exactly…again, since it’s against CLE, I expect it to be sparse, so we may be able to move way close. My fiance told me about a game she went to with a bunch of kids right at the field level, and they all left in the 7th inning, so her and her friends went down and sat there…..
"Real Orioles don't pout. Real Orioles don't gloat. Real Orioles just win."
by NewYorkOriole on May 4, 2010 12:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Moving closer is usually a viable option
Maybe a little bit less so on a weekend game as the weather’s getting warmer, but, as the saying goes, “Good seats still available.”
Left field fair territory, as close to the field as you can manage, are pretty much my favorite seats in the stadium. That’s where I have ended up in games the last couple of years and I haven’t had any problems.
I'm ready for a straight jacket. - Joe Angel, 4/17/10 (O's record: 1-11)
by Eat More Esskay on May 4, 2010 12:36 PM EDT up reply actions
centsports tip of the day
spanish primera division: villareal vs. almeria. money line on villareal is +120. spread is 0 and the line on almeria beating the spread is +130. you can fairly safely bet on both lines (say 22 and 25 cents). if they draw, you lose 3 cents. if either team wins, you’ll make a profit. i put 1.00 and 1.07 on those lines and can win either 25 or 30 cents depending on who wins. if they draw, its only a 7 cent loss. not a bad risk.
actually...momentary brain fart
you’d still lose half, but the risk is mitigated by the fact that the line on villareal to beat the spread of 0 is -165
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions
Does centsports let you make bets liket that?
The policy used to be you couldnt be on both sides of the line
the old one didnt
the new version lets you, which is more accurate to real betting
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I dunno
Its not accurate to real betting because with bonuses, you can create bets that are guaranteed to win. I’m glad they got rid of it, but it made sense to have in place.
Cant you just bet on the over and the under if you are getting a 25 or 50% bonus
And win everytime?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Come on fellas... just throw $10 into Bodog or sports.com or matchbook
And see how you do. I think most of them have a $1 minimum though….. but alot of them also have a texas holdem application that you can comingle your fund between.
Its a slippery slope though.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions
I've gone down that road before
centsports lets me get my gambling fix without getting myself in trouble
I hear you
Ive gone on some crazy swings in my life. I put $50 in my online bookmaker when I was in 11th grade and ran it up to a couple hundred bucks and was hooked ever since. 10 years of madness. I have lost 15K in one day before. Those days are long since over though. Now I usually bet between 2 and 500 a game.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
ive only done real betting a few times
used my “bet on both lines strategy” and made a few bucks. then i decided to get risky and bet on some underdogs and lost it. centsports gives me something to do without getting me into any trouble.
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
If I bet say $50 on an underdog, I’ll usually counter with $100 on a favorite. Seems to work out to where I either win big or break even. Although every underdog I bet on I think is really going to win, so I don’t just take the Pirates over the Phillies with Halladay on the mound just to try to make money.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Plus I try to exploit some of the extreme over/unders.
Like in last nights Colorado/San Diego game it was 6.5, so I took over (needed a 2 out RBI single by Matt Stairs in the bottom of the 9th to win). Then in the O’s game it was set a 9 with two good pitchers, so I took the under.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions
This is a rough way to play
Usually when Vegas has some extreme number, they didnt make a mistake, they are goading you into taking the sucker bet.
For instance, the over/under in the Cubs/D-backs game was 13 last Thursday (the highest Ive seen in years). My buddy called me begging to place a wager on the UNDER since 13 was an insance number…. I told him no because he was being suckered and obviously Vegas knew it was insane number. He got upset and didn’t talk to me the rest of the day. 18 runs later…..
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:50 PM EDT up reply actions
Yea that’s why I said I try to exploit them. I can usually tell if I’m trying to be suckered. Some times you can tell that either the over or under is going to be a pretty safe bet.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
This makes absolutely no sense to me
You bet on both the favorite AND the underdog on the MONEYLINE?
Please give an example of how this works.
If I bet 100 on the favorite of -150 I win $66, but I lose my $50 on the underdog netting me $16.
If I bet 50, on the underdog at +140 and win I make $70, but lose my $100 on the favorite losing a total of -$30.
How does this pay?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
No no.
Different games. If I bet on Baltimore (+250) I’ll try to bet double on say Philly (-150) with Halladay pitching.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I've been on Bodog for just about a week now
and I’m doing well. I have a pretty good strategy that either wins me a ton of money or breaks me even.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:37 PM EDT up reply actions
See just above.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions
no
you only get a bonus until you make 3 dollars. once you hit the three bucks, you stop getting a bonus. you cant bet on both the over and the under anyways.
real betting allows you to bet on both lines if you want. you arent guaranteed to win.
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:35 PM EDT up reply actions
But you could just bet the OVER and the UNDER everytime until you get up to $3
With the bonuses…. then the bonus stop and you can start playing seriously? Correct?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
nope
you can only bet on one or the other with the over/under. same with each line. only way you can do multiple bets on the same game is to do one bet on the money line and one bet on the spread.
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
It looks like
the policy blocking 2 moneyline/spread/overunder bets is still in place. I think this was just a special case because the spread happened to be 0 so you could do a moneyline and a spread bet that pretty closely approximates the the same thing.
Would you guys think it would be fun to do a 1-month handicapping challenge?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions
yea you cant do multiple money line bets or multiple spread bets
you have to bet on the spread and then bet on the money line.
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions
and you can do this in vegas
you arent guaranteed to win and you dont make much doing it. its a nice way to semi-safely increase your centsports balance tho.
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions
In baseball its a "runline"
Not being nitpicky
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions
haha.... my bad
Are you in for the handicapping challenge. I think it woudl be a good time.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Someone could start a spreadsheet
Ill try and find something online that might enable us to do it like a fantasy league with play money.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
okay...i'd be in
google docs would work
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
well yea, but i generally just do this on baseball games
but i’ll do the same thing if the spread is 0 on a soccer game.
its not really even worth it for games like the o’s since the yankees are favored to beat the “runline.”
by twistedlogic on May 4, 2010 12:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Gonna be a bouncy ride until Europe's debt is in order
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
The next few years are going to be real volitile
On inflation: The outlook isn’t great. Buffett commented that, “the prospects for significant inflation have increased. Not only here, but around the world.”
High inflation and uncertain investors means a bumpy ride most likely
"I have seen the future and his name is Matt Wieters." Keith Law
by Reddrummer9187 on May 4, 2010 1:34 PM EDT up reply actions
Im sure
Hyper inflation is completely inevitable with the spending we are doing. The dollar seems to be holding up only because the Euro is totally in the tank right now (hit its year low today). Im very concerned about my investments, but Im holding out until after this earnings season. My primary company reports on Thursday.
Sell in May, Go away….
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Hyperinflation is not a real concern for the US
Meanwhile, the goal of a lot of our current monetary policies is to promote some level of inflation; a big problem in recessions is oversaving, and inflation is a desired pressure to promote spending over saving. But the US has a variety of automatic stabilizers in place to prevent hyperinflation, and the collapse of the shadow banking system has led to a significant decrease in the growth of M3.
But I wouldn’t be too concerned about this; the point behind policies like quantitative easing was creating inflation. But certainly equities markets will remain highly volatile, and anything other than basic index fund investment in equities strikes me as a bad idea without inside information at present.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
But what happens when the Feds rate is at or near the lowest it can go
and inflation continues to spiral. Am I not to understand that the fed rate is the governments most effective inflation-fighter?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, they can change the Federal Funds Rate whenever they want
Again, some measure of inflation is currently the goal – in a financial crisis, you need to prevent massive deflation which triggers hoarding and prevents access to capital. But you can change this whenever you want if the pendulum begins to overswing in the other direction.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
But if its at 0%, thats it...
Now what do they do if inflation starts running again? Increasing the rate at which the banks lend money to each other isn’t going to help the inflation issue.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, the Federal Funds Rate isn't interbank lending
That’s the Prime Rate, which usually is about 3% more than the federal funds rate. But the Fed has a lot of control over money supply through open market operations, and the Federal Open Market Committee meets eight times a year and can meet more often if needed to control the money supply.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
But what do they do when its at 0.
Where can they go from there to fight inflation should it get out of control?
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, they go up...
…to fight inflation, they increase it to more than 0%. The problem is how to fight deflation when you can’t go lower than 0%. Which is where quantitative easing and other radical monetary policies come in.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Gotcha
I had a brainfart and had it backwards. Never took a class on this, just threw some money in the market and bought a couple books and tried my best to learn it from Benjamin Graham and some Buffet.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, good luck in the market mate
I dunno how important knowing this stuff really is for your needs (it isn’t like I’m making a killing or something), but you want to learn more, I might suggest picking up something a bit more introductory than Buffet – Krugman’s intro text is pretty good and easy to read, and if you want to see something from a different ideological perspective, you can always try Greg Mankiw. And you can probably get both at your local library.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Krugman
I will definitely check this out. Thanks for the tip. Yeah, Benjamin Grahams book was published in 1937 I think, but still has alot of sound economic principles (as far as I know anyway). Appreciate the tip. Thats why I enjoy being on the board, cuz its alot more than Orioles BS (although thats rightfully the main thrust). I enjoy discussing/debating/learning other important stuff as well though.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 2:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Graham is good...
…it is just particular to investing. But from the sound of things you seem to be interested in learning more general macroeconomics.
Another good source that I’m very fond of is Tyler Cowen’s blog Marginal Revolution. Cowen is a professor at George Mason and usually will put up a post or two explaining the economics behind things in the news. He also posts an ethnic dining guide for the DC metro area that I’ve found highly useful.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Is this the krugman book?
http://www.amazon.com/Economics-Paul-Krugman/dp/1572591501
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
Yes, but that's combined macro and microeconomics
There’s a cheaper macro-only textbook too. Although micro I think is more interesting.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
From the minor league recaps:
Shorebirds starting shortstop Garabez Rosa left the game in the top of the third due to an injury that the Minor League Baseball game recap called “an injured head.”
That sounds pretty serious.
Librarians are hiding something
Another example of Trembley's level of suck
pinch hitting for Atkins last night when he’s the only Orioles’ hitter with two hit. Win, lose or draw, Trembley still needs to go ASAP.
But Fatkings just owns CC
As I recall Rhyno came in to hit against Joba.
I probably would have made the same move.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions
Past events are an imperfect predictor of future events
As a rule, I think we tend to get carried away with this stuff. That a player has a hit in the game doesn’t mean he’ll get another; that a reliever has gotten a couple guys out doesn’t mean he’ll get the next guy out.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
And in even simpler terms
Garrett Atkins sucks.
Sometimes I just want to talk about beer, blowjobs and baseball, y’know? -2632
Its time for... The Wheel of Suck!!!
Lugo
Atkins <——- Albers
Scott
And Garrett Atkins Wins!!
by Philly O's on May 4, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Actually,
in simlpler terms: don’t pinch hit for someone with two hits. It doesn’t matter if Ceeezar was 2-3, i’d leave him in the situation. That’s the only thing that’s simple.
And I’d love to see Rhyno do well, but it’s becoming more apparent every game that he’s not a great hitter. Pitchers will eat him up after a couple months of data/film.
The fact that Garrett Atkins had two hits
does not mean that he is suddenly a good hitter. This is grasping at straws, IMO, for someone looking to point to a mistake made by Dave Trembley.
Sometimes I just want to talk about beer, blowjobs and baseball, y’know? -2632
I'm not saying
Atkins is suddenly a good hitter, as seen in my Ceeezar reference. It’s just common knowledge in baseball (or sports) to go with a hot hand, or bat in this case.
Most studies have shown...
…that the “hot hand” phenomenon is a product of randomness and not anything else – flip a coin enough times and it will come up heads or tails repeatedly for long streaks. But that doesn’t impact the probability that the next flip will be heads.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
However
There is no doubt that Luke is super streaky.. mainly for the worst. But when he heats up, HE HEATS UP.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't know that there is no doubt about this
There are a lot of factors at play with individuals that can’t be measured entirely by statistical analysis – like why Teixeira is consistently a crap hitter in April. But with Luke we only have a couple years of him as a starter to look at.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
I know this is oversimplifying things
But I play alot of pickup basketball. And some days, my shot just ‘feels good’. I know when it leaves my hand its going in. Not as a matter of randomness, but I just have a ‘hot hand’. Other days, I cant hit the back of a barn and no Im struggling to get a good release. Im pretty sure this is the same phenomenon across sports. Somedays it feels like you are shooting a beachball into the ocean, other days you are trying to fit the thread in the needle.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Two things...
…how it feels to you isn’t necessarily how it is. But also, we’re not talking about people at your skill level in basketball (unless you’re really really good). We’re talking about people who are among the top 1% in the world at hitting baseballs.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
So using this logic
every hitter should bat .500?
Some days you see the ball at the plate better than others… simple fact.
No
He’s saying that if Nick Markakis is a .290 hitter…. he’ll always come back to his average, whether he hits .600 for a month, or .050 for a month.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
batter/pitcher matchups
Small sample size!
I came to camdenchat and all I got was this lousy avatar.
On this note,
how do we square this with our love for Earl Weaver? He was all about keeping track of matchups, even though they’re always small sample sizes, and he often acted on them (such as letting Belanger hit against Nolan Ryan in a critical situation rather than pinch-hitting).
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -- Earl Weaver
Just because the information you have is flawed, doesn't mean you ignore it.
So if batter X only have 8 ABs against pitcher Y and batter X has struck out 5 out of 8 of those times, I would pay attention to the information.
I came to camdenchat and all I got was this lousy avatar.
he makes our situation sounds way worse than i feel like it is.
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=crasnick_jerry&id=5161158
It’s the Ric Flair Theory of baseball – To be the man, you gotta beat the man. -duck
by Parkinglotninja on May 4, 2010 12:59 PM EDT reply actions
Eh, the article doesn't even make it sound that bad
The problem isn’t our record now. Or even the holy suckitude of Atkins and our pathetic bullpen.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
im not really liking
how he called attention to the sympathy and pity “itll get better’s” and “keep your chin ups” the yankess gave us…idk,,,maybe its my birdland pride…kinda feels like its a aww look how the orioles continue to try article…
oh well…well show them when we dfa our bullpen and teach our players how to hit!
we got this…this is birdland..right?
It’s the Ric Flair Theory of baseball – To be the man, you gotta beat the man. -duck
by Parkinglotninja on May 4, 2010 1:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Nothing the Yankees have to say...
…beyond “The Orioles just outplayed us today” interests me.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
It's clear that DT is very well liked and respected within baseball
And I really want to like Dave myself, but he needs to quit this hit and run BS!
I came to camdenchat and all I got was this lousy avatar.
Nice to see an 'adult' article about Trembley
This is better than the usual lazy crap about ‘managers on the hotseat’ from guys like Heyman and Rosenthal.
No matter who it is, the O’s manager is screwed unless Andy MacPhail finds a way make the O’s a decent team. We’ve read the above story about the last two, three, four managers… It won’t change until the club changes.
by drj on May 4, 2010 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
in fact, if I remember correctly, the player openly revolted against Mazzilli and Perlozzo.
I came to camdenchat and all I got was this lousy avatar.
17 year old running around Phillies stadium gets tasered
What’s your opinion on it?
I don’t see why people are freaking out over it. The kid deserved it. ZAP
Fine by me
Don’t be an idiot and you won’t get tasered. Seems like a good rule for life in general.
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
by daveh873 on May 4, 2010 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
+1
to both of you.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -- Earl Weaver
Tasers are very dangerous and badly overused by law enforcement
I don’t think it is the use of force to restrain the fan in question as much as it is an example of the expansion of the use of highly dangerous non-lethal force that is troublesome.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
by James F on May 4, 2010 1:13 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I agree
Anyone see that video in Seattle where they got that white lady with a black bag over her face, and they just pull that tripper over and over when she is already restrained, and she’s just screaming?
I don’t think the Phillies game incident is similar to that.
I’m generally against robo-cops and giving them dangerous toys to play with, but tasers have probably saved a lot of lives.
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on May 4, 2010 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
less-than-lethal
as in, less likely to kill a target than conventional weapons. I hate the way tasers are used by the police, but I’m someone who’s naturally suspicious an skeptical of law enforcement officers to begin with. As in: they are not constitutionally required to protect you. But that’s probably another story…
I'm with you
Part of the problem with less-than-lethal weapons is that it increases the overall use of force – the standards for the use of less-than-lethal are much lower than the standards for lethal force. And as someone who thinks the use of force is generally ill-advised, increasing the use of force is something I tend to oppose.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Less-than-lethal
is also a tremendous misnomer for tasers. The present a significant risk of death in certain populations that is not appreciated by a lot of taser users. less-than-always-lethal? sure. But their use is not commensurate with possibility of harm they present.
did you see that one csi episode where the guy got hit with a taser
and preceded to burst into flames? pretty cool.
oh it was a fabrication
they went thru the whole case to figure out why the guy burst into flames. don’t remember exactly why, but it was cool anyways.
There is a substantial electric charge involved
I guess if the guy was like a gas station attendent or something, there could be enough fumes soaked into his clothes to ignite or something
Actually, it happnened a couple times
But it’s because there is some flamable liquid involved.
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions
agree
I don’t think a skinny drunk kid really deserves to have his life put in danger by an overweight cop for being an idiot, but thankfully it looks like he came out of it no worse for wear. Imagine, though, if the cops really started working the kid over, right there on the field? I hope fans would have enough courage to do something like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_3LVgeOTjqg
I hope I would.
Dont they set them at way different voltages
And couldnt this particular case involved a police officer setting it at a low voltage to get him down but not harm him?
I havent read much about the whole story to be honest.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions
But why not just tackle him? It’s a time tested way of stopping this activity without hurting anyone.
And I don’t think they do have different settings, but I could be wrong.
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions
And who knows...
Perhaps the kid has a knife in his pocket. I NEVER get searched going into the stadium. I wonder why we are more interested in protecting the dirtbag than protecting the people who have to face this on a daily basis. When you have to walk up to that house and pacify a domestic dispute you never know what you are going to get. You err on the side of protecting yourself. Its easy to Monday morning QB these guys all day. But when you serve in Iraq or Afghanistan, you see some weird shit and you dont have time to always make the best assessment. You do your best. I dont think the officer wanted to hurt him as much as he wanted to subdue him.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions
This one should have been pretty easy to Sunday afternoon quarterback; people running on to the field is not that uncommon. There was nothing unusual about this incident up until the kid got tasered.
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm surprised more parks don't Taser
Why take the chance of getting that close to someone when I can take them down from 10 feet away? I’m with WW on this one.
"Oh, and Joe? If Brian hits any of your delicate millionaires, know that he meant it." - Stacey
I've been unsure how I feel about the tasering
But I think I’m ok with the taser. Serious injury appears to be very rare. You could tackle the guy, but that could result in injury as well.
I came to camdenchat and all I got was this lousy avatar.
because he was too fat/slow to tackle him. obviously.
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
Agreed, but like I said, if he spent more time on the treadmill and less time playing with the stun gun…
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 5:07 PM EDT up reply actions
definitely
they could also do a better job staffing – might want to have some people who CAN run on stadium patrol…
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
why are the police outside?
they should be…inside! eating donuts…..and looking at the prints from fingers!
The harm isnt always predicable
Its entirely possible that the kid has a heart condition or something where even a low voltage taser could put his life in danger. Just like people have argued that the officer had to take into account the possibility that he wasnt just a dumb kid, they have to take into the possibility of causing him serious harm as a result of the table and its generally a misunderstood possibility.
In that context, the potential harm caused seems to me to exceed the potential harm avoided.
I don't know about all that...
two wrongs and all. And it looked to me like they were kicking the shit out of the guy that was trying to stop the other guy from beating the fan.
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
What those "fans" did was idiotic
and most definitely NOT courageous.The cops have a job to do. You want to not be tackled? Don’t break the law. You want to not be abused? Don’t resist arrest and endanger the officers. It’s not that hard. When fans pile on like that all it does is incite chaos and alot more people get hurt.
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
pfft
The cops were thugs who were beating the shit out of a skinny defenseless kid. How can you condone that? Have you no empathy? All this talk about “the rule of law” from you really smacks of fascism. I can’t believe you don’t see it.
You don't know what was going on in there
and regardless, he’s still the one that broke the law. I’m NOT saying the cops were in the right, but I am definitely saying causing a riot only hurts more people and does not help anything.
And it’s not “fascist” to think that doing something obviously against the law is idiotic, especially when you know you can’t possibly get away with it and it’s a completely pointless crime. All you are doing at that point is putting yourself and others at danger for absolutely nothing but your own personal enjoyment.
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
In where? Inside the scrum on the field?
I know that a bunch of huge guys armed with clubs are beating the shit out of one skinny unarmed dude. So it was against the law to trespass on the field, but as James F and kba said above, the response by the police – ie beating the shit out of a dude – was not commensurate with the infraction. They could have killed that guy had no one stepped in. The police were out of control and thankfully a bystander couldn’t sit idly as he watched the injustice unfold. That IS courage.
hahaha oh god spare me
the bystander stepped in and saved the guy??? Get the fuck out of here. The crowd started a fucking riot! And it was just one cop jabbing him – the other cop was trying to stop him and that’s the cop who got stomped and kicked in the head over and over again. Yeah…great work by the crowd.
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
Now those officers, and hopefully the police force in general
will understand that they can’t get away with beating the shit out of people. Unfortunately you’re living proof that such a demonstration against injustice will probably never happen in this country – you and people like you will just shrug their shoulders and say “The guy deserved it” as cops stomp the shit out of anyone they come across. The College Park incident recently is a great example, as well as the many other incidents in PG county over the years. No one speak up or acts out and police officers think they can do whatever they want because they’ve gotten away with doing whatever they want.
College Park riot =/= Philly fan
The “skinny dude” turned out to be an unarmed 17 tear old kid AFTER HE WAS TASERED. While he’s on the field? He’s an unknown.
He could have a knife, like Monica Seles’ attacker. Monica was never the same after that.
He could be on meth, and completely out of his mind and incapable of rational thought. Or maybe owes Joba Chamberlain’s mom money.
He could be armed – and holding a grudge. Ask Dimebag Darrell of Pantera about that – oh, you can’t, because he’s DEAD from being shot by a disgruntled fan at a concert.
Sure, we think it’s terrible an unarmed 17-year-old kid got Tasered. But those law enforcement on the field didn’t know that. And that’s a hell of a lot different than dozens of cops on horses beating the shit out of drunk college students.
"Oh, and Joe? If Brian hits any of your delicate millionaires, know that he meant it." - Stacey
I don't think the two situations are analogous at all
"Oh, and Joe? If Brian hits any of your delicate millionaires, know that he meant it." - Stacey
Vigilante justice it is!
Who cares if the crowd learned that from now on whenever something happens they don’t like they should just kick somebody in the face while they’re laying on the ground!! And again who gives a shit if they kicked the shit out of the wrong guy!!!
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
You can condemn it all you want. And I do.
But don’t go attacking them to make it better. How exactly does that help?
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
On one hand, he broke clearly-posted rules and is potentially a danger to players and coaches on the field (though it sounded like this guy was just the typical run around the field till I get caught idiot, which i find terribly amusing).
On the other hand, especially in Philly where every bit of fan behavior or over-response is going to be magnified in the media into a national story, more restraint probably should have been used.
To be clear
I agree more restraint should have been used. However, the idiot running on the field put himself in harms way over a very stupid (and cleary prohibited) act. If he wasn’t tasered, he very likely would have been tackled to the ground, and that itself could result in worse harm than being tasered (have you ever seen them bring someone down at Yankee stadium, especially post-9/11?).
My point is, people will give the officer grief for tasering the kid, and rightly so to an extent. However, the person creating that situation is NOT just a victim here. Don’t be an idiot and you won’t get tasered.
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
Don't Tase Me Bro!
ahhh. to tase or not to tase. My stance is don’t be a douche bag and you won’t get tased. If you are unsure of your potential douche baggery, most likely it will result in a tasering. Clearly the kid needed 5 minutes of fame. To me this is no different from the likes of Snooki, the ugly Kardashian, Steve from Tough Love, and Paris Hilton. All of whom contribute absolutely nothing to society and need to be tasered.
I fucking love that video.
I laugh absolutely hysterically every time I watch it.
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
I agree
The kid obviously shouldn’t have run on the field and I’m not going to lose sleep over him getting tasered; but I would also prefer if the cops didn’t go around tasering people when it’s clearly unnecesary (at least in my opinion).
I think that cop should have spending a little less time practicing his taser shooting and a little more time hitting the treadmill.
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
still
you seem to be a sound individual that knows the difference between right and wrong. And I am sure this kid does too. The problem is there are so many jerk-offs out there that don’t and will continue to do something until someone gets hurt. Police officers have to look at the situation and determine the course of action in a matter of seconds and may have to assume the worse. They don’t know this kid’s grades, his background, or that fact he just wanted 5 minutes of fame. While we can all sit here and say whether or not it was the right thing to do, we are doing so after we have had time to think about it and understand the motive behind it. The officer on the other hand, does not.
Sure
He has to decide in a few seconds what the right amount of force is, which isn’t always easy; but that’s his job. And as those decisions go, this seems to me to be one of the easier ones. You have a kid running around the OF of a ML baseball game waving a towel with no one other than officers and security guards around. This isn’t that unique of an occurence where a quality officer should have a problem deciding that there is little to no serious threat to anyone and that the kid is not going to get away.
If the kid turned around agressively towards a security guard, pulled any form of a weapon out or started chasing a player, I could see using the taser; but from the video I saw, tasering him was unneccesary.
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions
so
when the officer said stop and kid didn’t, that means he still has the right to run around and the officer does not have the right to use force. thats where i see no wrong in using force. at the point when the kid is told to stop and refuses then he is not respecting authority and therefore is subject to the means to bring it to an end. the point is stop means stop. listen, I was a punk kid and got literally thrown out of concerts and as a punk adult got thrown out of bars. I know I was being a jerk-off, it hurt, and I get that. but some dude telling me to leave wasn’t going to get my drunk ass off that bar stool. I’ll tell you that.
when the officer said stop and kid didn’t, that means he still has the right to run around and the officer does not have the right to use force.
No, of course not. The kid clearly didn’t have a right to run around (or be on the field in the first place) and the cop clearly had a right to use force. I just think the amount of force was unnecasary. The officer has the responsibility to use only the amount of force that is reasonably neccesary to subdue the field jumper. I think tackling and handcuffing the kid was all that was neccesary here. This exact situation has come up hundreds of times before, and wrestling the person to the ground always seems to work. It’s not like he was running right towards the umpire like what happened at Chicago or running at an athlete with a knife like what happened to Monica Seles. Nobody was reasonably at danger here and the kid was clearly not going to get away.
Just because I think the cop probably shouldn’t have tasered the kid, doesn’t mean the kid was in the right.
"Hey Yankees... you can take your apology and your trophy and shove 'em straight up your ass!" --Tanner Boyle
by BirdFanInPhilly on May 4, 2010 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions
until tonite
where some asshole, knowing he wont be tasered after last night’s debacle, jumps onto the field
I generally agree Dave, and I’ve seen video of some guys get crushed by guards or even occasionally players.
I’ve never personally been tased or tackled by a security guard…I just think in Philly of all cities this would turn into a PR nightmare if nothing else. Just tackle the kid like everyone else.
Here's my gut reaction entry:
“In brightest day, in blackest night, no evil shall escape my sight. Let those who worship evil’s might, beware my power, Green Lantern’s light!”
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
I was more thinking about all the amazing things that could be photoshopped into his guys hand
but a caption contest works too
A member of General Manager Ruben Amaro, Jr.‘s personal security detail chases Phillies pitcher Nelson Figueroa off the field with a Taser after the right-hander surrendered a bases clearing double to David Freese in the top of the seventh inning in tonight’s game against the St. Louis Cardinals.
by kba26 on May 4, 2010 5:29 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
"People in Arizona change their mind about new strict immigration reform"
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 3:44 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
This is funniest coming from a resident CC conservative
That’s really a great action shot. I think the photographer lucked into one there.
I'm ready for a straight jacket. - Joe Angel, 4/17/10 (O's record: 1-11)
by Eat More Esskay on May 4, 2010 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
FYI
After trying several handicappers over the year, I finally found one that is working out for me. A handicapper is someone who gives you picks based on their computer generated analysis of insider info (Im pretty sure there isn’t much of the latter). In any case, SMM at ULTRA SPORTS have been working out very well for me and have netted a really nice chunk of money over the past couple of months. I will share their picks for free as long as no one posts them on sports gambling forums around the net as this could result in suspension of my account (which they say they can track everything back to the source).
In any case, so far tonight they are on: Cincinnati and Houston
Probably more picks to follow.
Again, this is just an FYI if you are in sports betting at all… if not, please disregard.
Cool
Much appreciated!
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on May 4, 2010 1:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I suggest
Just using this as a reference and doing your own due diligence. If you like the pick then bet it. If for some reason, you dislike it, just leave it alone.
by Wieters Wieners on May 4, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
are players still allowed to swing axes instead of bats?
luke could always give that a shot
"On my tombstone just write, 'The sorest loser that ever lived.'"
Earl Weaver
i think after chris hanson put one in his leg they banned them from clubhouses
luke apparently does chop wood in the offseason
Quick Question
Does anyone know if my friend attempts a short-sale of his home if it will wreck is credit. I was under the impression its way better for your credit than a foreclosure as you and the bank reach an agreement.
definitely much better than foreclosure
not sure if there is zero impact, but I know it’s dramatically better than foreclosure. For everybody involved.
Rub some $100 bills on it, you sell-out. -duck
Tonight's lineup
from Britt’s twitter:
Jones
Markakis
Wieters
Tejada
Wiggy
Scott
Atkins DH
Hughes
Izzy
Sometimes I just want to talk about beer, blowjobs and baseball, y’know? -2632
I'm done complaining about it
I like hughes, izzy makes up for it with his glove, and theres not much we can about the rest.
I'm completely fine with it
except I still rather see Reimold instead of Atkins
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
ARGUMENT! ARGUMENT!
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
I was actually about to complement him for maybe my first time ever
I went to his new burger place in Philly today for lunch, was pretty phenomenal. I still think his more upscale cuisine gets more credit than it deserves, but he seems to have nailed the gourmet burger concept.
Its not the best burger in the city
but for the price, it was pretty awesome. Burger and fries is about 10 bucks, and they have surprisingly cheap beer (and spiked milkshakes, which i’ve yet to try).
Theres a bunch of different burgers, but i ordered it as basically plain as they would let me because i wanted to really be able to taste the meat the first time I went. Was definitely a pretty high quality meat for the price, and they actually are willing to serve it pretty rare for a chain restaurant. Theres definitely a burger renaissance going on right now, and he’s definitely put out a worthy addition to the trend.
i love gourmet burgers
i wanna open my own gourmet burger shop someday.
spiked milkshakes sound baller.
I honestly believe that the guy wouldn't have been tased if he was in say, San Diego.
It seems like it’s mainly about the reputation of Philly fans.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:23 PM EDT reply actions
This is the same city that had a jail within their baseball/football stadium.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Its a self-perpetuating stereotype at this point
He got tased because he’s a philly fan, and now philly is known as the city where you have to tase the fans.
O/U ofr tonight's game is 9.
That’s a pretty easy under pick.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:29 PM EDT reply actions
ugh, for tonight's game.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions
me 3.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Where's the cancel button on the new layout?
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:40 PM EDT up reply actions
If you did, I didn't see it.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, I didn't see the options button.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:42 PM EDT up reply actions
Done.
Everyone thought Baltimore was three easy wins and we got our ass kicked three times. - Dustin Pedoria, After the Red Sox got swept by the Orioles.
by BaltimoreSportsFan on May 4, 2010 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions
I went all out
and bet .10 on the O’s winning AND the under. Gonna turn my dime into 7 dimes! Woot!
"You accept mediocrity and you get mediocrity." - Adam Jones, Son!
i went all out as well
and bet 1 dolla on the nats, giants, reds, and padres. gonna turn my dolla in 7 dollahs! woot!
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