OT: Inception (with Spoiler Discussion)
by Andrew_G on Jul 19, 2010 4:27 PM EDT
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Feel free to destroy this post if someone beats me to the publish punch.
So, the big summer movie event finally came out this past weekend with director Christopher Nolan's (The Dark Knight, Memento) Inception, starring Leonardo DiCaprio, Ellen Page, Ken Watanabe, Cillian Murphy, and Joseph Gordon-Levitt. I can't advise avoiding spoilers enough, but this is America, man.
A lot of the discussion seems to be revolving around the idea of whether or not the entire movie is the first level of the dream, which would make the entire thing a subconscious rendering of Cobb's. For my part, I disagree with that notion in favor of a possibly stupid offering: it's a movie. Duh, I know.
Consider this: DiCaprio said his inspiration for the character of Cobb was Nolan himself, and certainly there are a great many similarities between the rules of dreams in Inception and the rules of great movies: the worst possible thing is for the target (or audience) to realize they are asleep (or in a movie). The strange thematic recurring images like Cobb's children are inherent to filmmaking as well. Movies literally are shared dreams. The whole movie is about that very concept. You could say that the entire story is the first level of the dream, but it's Christopher Nolan's dream, not Cobb's, or anybody else's.
Which is meta and great and really, really revealing to me. Other thoughts:
1) The gimbel-powered fight is the stuff of movie legends. Oddly, I was almost as excited about seeing more of the cool version of Joseph Gordon-Levitt (you can take [500] Days of Summer, I'll stick with Inception and Brick), and man did he deliver the charm and the muscle. Oh, that fight!
2) PhilR8 mentioned it, too, but the theatre I was in was outstanding. The final shot of Cobb's token spinning almost felt to me like thumbing the nose at the idea of twist endings, and the audible "whoosh" from the audience sort of confirmed that feeling for me.
Anyway, those are my very basic reactions after having seen it once on Friday in IMAX. I'll probably check it out at least once more - which is really rare for me as a filmgoer - and my opinions will almost definitely change and evolve. What did you all think?
FanPosts are user-created content and do not necessarily reflect the views of the editors of Camden Chat or SB Nation. They might, though.
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I saw it here:
http://www.cinetopiatheaters.com/cinema/digitalc.htm pretty crazy.
Im gonna see it again when I go to LA. I have a few questions for debate:
A.O. Scott mentioned 2001 in his review. I haven’t seen that movie in like, 6 years, did you guys see any nods to Kubrick?
My one disappointment was the final dream stage, some of the stuff was cool but it seemed to stray from a dream world to a 007 with Pierce Bronson set.
Bring back Andino.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 19, 2010 4:32 PM EDT reply actions
i find the 007 comparison
both apt and purposeful. I mean, skiers with machine guns? It was basically The Living Daylights.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I see much more Matrix than 007 for the action sequences
As far as 2001 goes, I don’t see any obvious nods to Kubrick.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Also
“Dark Knight, Memento” —> Batman Begins was better than the Dark Knight. Just sayin’
Bring back Andino.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 19, 2010 4:34 PM EDT reply actions
well, that's just lying to yourself
hey, we all do it! We all lie to ourselves everyday to make ourselves feel better, Lenny.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Dark Knight was more of a spectacle
but I still prefer BB, I still love the Dark Knight, but…..
Bring back Andino.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 19, 2010 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions
they're both good movies
but TDK wins because of three words:
no Katie Holmes
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
and heath ledger's joker
+ aaron eckhart’s two-face > cillian murphy’s scarecrow + the liam neeson corporate bad guy. and i love cillian murphy too (he was also in inception).
I never liked Aaron Eckhart in that part
Well, that’s not entirely true. I liked him as Two-Face a lot more than I liked him as Harvey Dent. It always felt to me that Eckhart was trying to say three words in the time it took to say two. Don’t know if that makes any sense.
Yeah but a slick politician that was supposed to win me over based on his lantern jaw and smooth, confident demeanor
Eckhart had the jaw, but the delivery was just never there for me.
i liked it a lot
i also saw him in “meet bill” and remember liking it, but for the life of me can’t remember anything else about it
Yeah it was great
He totally pulls it off in that movie. Not sure what the difference is, since it’s been a while since I’ve seen either movie, but in Smoking, he just seemed like a guy dedicated to his job, not really someone who wanted to be a white knight. In TDK, I think I was supposed to believe that Dent was really trying to be all things to all people, right? Super dedicated public servant who was trying to be equally dedicated to all aspects of his professional and personal life while making it all look easy. Maybe the problem is on my end, since I don’t even know what I’m saying anymore. It’s hard to think straight on Monday.
no katie holmes was a good thing
but i was severely disappointed by maggie gyllenhaal’s performance. i thought she was better than that.
His icon worked about 3/4 of the movie in
He couldn’t have been in limbo or any level of dream during the entire movie
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
actually it's totem not icon, my bad.
His totem spins and fall down at one point during the movie. By that fact, he could have NOT been in a dream or limbo during the entire movie.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Yeah but I raised a concern in the other deleted thread
was that during a flashback? I don’t remember the top actually falling – or spinning place – except during the flashbacks. I could be wrong. Need to see it again.
I don't think it was during a flashback.
But I could be wrong. He must have fell into limbo or another dream between being on the plane and arriving at home.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
pretty sure it fell early in the movie
in the hotel, before they went up to meet watanabe in the helicopter
This is something I need to see again
at some point I got lost in how his totem worked. Ellen Page’s fell over a certain way, and Arthur’s had a certain weight to it, but I thought the top spun forever…but was that just in dreams?
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Somebody had a loaded dice. It was never shown but it is presumed that it would not work if he was still dreaming. Ellen Page’s totem was never shown. I think she said, “I was thinking about picking this item.” That’s as far as it got.
As far as Cobb’s totem goes, he said his wife used that top totem and if it fell down, it meant he was awake. He never explicitly said it was his totem as well, but at point he used it in the movie, it fell down, and he signed relief, thus he clearly believed it was his totem as well.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
No
Arthur had the die and Ellen had a chess piece that she made.
Bring back Andino.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 19, 2010 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions
Arthur (JGL) had the die
and he showed it to Ellen Page but wouldn’t let her touch it. Page was shown in one shot altering the weight of a chess knight and then she wouldn’t show it to Cobb.
That makes sense, so that when he spun it in her safe, it was the idea that she was dreaming. That clears things up.
So that last shot then, it felt more to me like Cobb finally able to stop worrying, and let his dreams of his dead wife go. Earlier on he looked almost Gollum-esque spinning his top in his corner of the warehouse, and he was finally able to just let it go.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I like the idea that the movie is Nolan's dream
and that there isn’t a really deep and wordy interpretation of how Ariadne was really Mal, who really survived the fall and was in the real world etc. Not that I’m disparaging anyone who likes to really dig into the movie and try to tease out a deep, complicated explanation, but I choose not to subscribe to anything like that. I’m taking the movie at face value and the only thing I’m debating is the very end.
And re: Joseph Gordon Levitt – anyone seen The Lookout? Probably my favorite JGL film. Although Inception may have just moved it to #2.
no Brick? Boooo
my girlfriend was getting weirded out by my anticipation for Inception, which went something like this:
Christopher Nolan! Joseph Gordon-Levitt! I have no idea what this movie is about! Gimbel fight!
She kept reminding me that he was in Third Rock from the Sun, and that I needed to get a life.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
i didn't much like the Lookout
but Brick is awesome, one of my all-time faves, and i still like 10 Things I Hate About You also. also like him in Shadowboxer and (500) but would like to forget him in GI Joe.
The Lookout is quite good
I’m fonder of Brick, but then, I would be.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
right - because you love Chandler
that makes sense. Did you see The Brothers Bloom (not that that has much to do with Chandler)?
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
quite
it’s very, very different tonally than Brick (though both JGL and the villian girl make cameos) but it had some good, obvious literary references to dig into and was really good on its own, balancing the preconceptions of the audience in a movie about Con Men with what it wanted to do.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Cool
I’ll add it to the backlog. I don’t watch many movies anymore.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
see? we are different!
I try to watch at least one brand new movie a week, or at least to revisit something I havent seen in a while. Instant Queue helps tremendously.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I used to watch a lot of movies...
…but for various reasons I don’t really want to talk about here, I just can’t anymore.
At this point, I can really only tolerate movies if I feel like I’m seeing something new. And that rarely happens – most movies are about other movies, just like most television shows are about other television shows. And I can’t take it.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Aren't you in the industry
although based on your comment, maybe you were in the industry? I remember you mentioning that you got cheated out of overtime working on National Treasure (2?).
Brothers Bloom is great too
love love love the “i collect hobbies” scene with Rachel Weisz and Adrien Brody. JGL actually has a cameo in that movie.
Casting
I would have liked to see someone other than DiCaprio, who most have a thing for playing troubled people in mind films.
Nolan used a lot of his Batman connections: Murphy, Caine, Wattanabe.
Was Murphy really a good choice though, he was so much better at the malicious creepy character, Batman Begins and Red Eye, I thought he did a good job in his final scene.
Finally, I liked the story, but the whole, rich kid who has a father that doesn’t love him but really does, gets old. I thought Nolan could have done something deeper there.
Bring back Andino.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 19, 2010 4:52 PM EDT reply actions
Finally, I liked the story, but the whole, rich kid who has a father that doesn’t love him but really does, gets old. I thought Nolan could have done something deeper there.
I loved that subplot and the part that the idea needed to cathartic.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Agreed
Also liked the casting with the exception of Mal. I didn’t like anything about her and was glad she didn’t have much screen time.
Tom Hardy and JGL pretty much stole the show, at least for me. Anyone seen Bronson? It’s an okay movie, but Tom Hardy is great in it.
He was also Shinzon in Star Trek: Nemesis. Thankfully his career recovered from that mess.
i didn't know who tom hardy was
but i thought he may have played the best character in the movie. apparently he was also in “layer cake”, which was a great brit crime flick with daniel craig.
was he? I didn't realize that
haven’t seen layer cake in a while, though. Love Michael Gambon.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I don't think it is really that complicated
I enjoyed the movie a lot, but I see it as being pretty standard: Leo wants to go home to see his kids, and he has to do X to do so, and X is really hard, and here is the story of how he manages to do X.
The rest of it is just inserted doubt. Maybe the totem keeps spinning, maybe it falls. Maybe the model that Ariadne is working on that Leo says not to show to him is the world he made with Edith Piaf, maybe it isn’t. You can’t be sure; you’re not supposed to be able to be sure. It isn’t a mystery to be solved; it is part of the experience that is being created that you don’t know, that there is a sense of mystery.
But it doesn’t matter. The test is that Leo has to do X to see his kids’ faces. And he does X, and he gets to see them. Whether or not that is “real” in some absolute sense is immaterial; “he” really gets to see “them”. The rest is about the experience of getting there.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
I enjoyed the movie a lot, but I see it as being pretty standard: Leo wants to go home to see his kids, and he has to do X to do so, and X is really hard, and here is the story of how he manages to do X.
The rest of it is just inserted doubt.
Yes, I very much agree. It’s a very straightforward movie until the last two minutes. Like I said in the other thread, I’m going to assume that his totem will keep spinning because, well, that’s what we’re shown even it wobbles a bit. It’s trying to interpret that final shot that’s a real pain in the ass.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
But like I said there....
…that’s a mistake. The point of that shot, of the wobble and the cutaway, is to not tell you. It is like the end of the Sopranos – it is explicitly saying that the creators know that this is where you expect a definitive answer, and then saying “We’re not going to give it to you.”
In part because knowing is never as interesting as not knowing.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
t is explicitly saying that the creators know that this is where you expect a definitive answer, and then saying "We’re not going to give it to you."
And like I said, I agree. And the, “we’re not going to give it you,” is what is frustrating. By straightforward, I mean that everything that happens in the movie until the last scene is what you exactly see. They implant the idea and all of them escape to reality.
And don’t get me started on Sopranos. There is a definitive answer. The show ends with him eating at a diner with his family PERIOD. Any thing else is (usually crazy ass) speculation.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
well, then
Inception ends with him seeing his kids again PERIOD. Happy ending.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Inception ends with him seeing his kids again PERIOD in reality or in a dream PERIOD.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
or
as I think I read it: neither. Or both.
I think one of the central themes of the movie, the underlying thesis of Nolan’s work is that the way he sees film is as a dream world, and that the power of film is to evoke these incredibly strong emotional responses inside of someone even if they didn’t technically plant that idea themselves.
Consider the James Bond level. Cobb (the director) and Adriande (the screenwriter) built this Jame Bondsian world for Cillian Murphy (the audience) to discover something personal and poignant about his relationship with his father…the way, say, Wes Anderson built the world of The Royal Tenenbaums (to use my own example…and maybe you have some movie that was moving for you in your own way…not unlike a totem, if you see what I’m saying) in order for me, the audience, to have a sort of carthasis of my own (though a very, very different kind of one).
Following through on that, the last shot seems to say “this is a movie and a dream and neither”. If that makes any sense. YMMV
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I don't agree that is the underlying thesis of Nolan's work
I mean, I don’t really think his work has an underlying thesis, but if it did, I don’t think it would be that.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
like I said
that’s just how I read it. It’s a movie, you can disagree about it, that’s cool and the gang.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Well, I have extremely strong feelings about TDK...
…and I just find this incompatible.
If I had to pick a recurring theme, it would be that of duality, and about nemeses. For example, I think that the Joker is intentionally the hero of TDK, while Batman is the villain (which is part of why I’m totally sad that he is supposedly making a third – there is no where left to go) – taking the character where Frank Miller and Alan Moore started to go to its conclusion.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
oh, I just meant Inception
there’s obviously a ton of themes that Nolan is obsessed with running throughout his entire filmography, even counting Following (which I don’t really recommend).
I’m with you on Batman. Why try to make a third? You can’t possibly go anywhere interesting with the story, or top yourself, you’d only disappoint. But, alas, the beancounters will win this argument I’m afraid.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
so far, every Nolan movie i've seen, i've loved
i’ll give him the benefit of the doubt for now. that said, i thought batman was the weakest character in TDK.
that's the fault of batman comics
he’s soooo flat it’s astounding. His character motivations are solely “XXX died and that fuels me. I’m the Bat Man”. Once you get past his origin story, Batman is solely defined by his villains.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I think this is more complicated
Batman is a representation of the philosopher-king archetype – he’s the king of Gotham, essentially. And at the time of Batman’s creation, he’s intended to represent the Andrew Carnergie/Henry Frick/Joe Kennedy philanthropist/baron as patron-savior of urban America.
That takes on a different tone in the post-modern Batman books and is brought to its ultimate conclusion in TDK – the Batman impersonator asks him what gives him the right – “I’m not wearing hockey pads” – my wealth gives me power that ordinary people have not.
The Joker exists as the repudiation of Batman’s order through power. In the classical interpretation of the character, the Joker has only one purpose – to destroy Batman and render his efforts moot. In The Dark Knight Returns, it is made explicit – the Joker happily sits in Arkham until Batman comes out of retirement. What Batman is doing is repugnant, and the Joker is the consequence of that.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
That's interesting
and something I hadn’t thought much about. I take issue with the idea of Joker as hero though, since he specifically attacks and destroys Harvey Dent, who is the one guy bringing peace to Gotham the democratic, lawful way (as opposed to Batman’s brute strength).
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
This presupposes that democracy and law is just...
….which certainly Frank Miller and Alan Moore don’t believe, and I don’t know that Nolan believes either. Remember, the agents of the law are portrayed as being almost always corrupt in the world of Batman.
But you also have to understand, the events to a large extent are predetermined – Dent is Wayne’s way of having his cake and eating it too – he gets the Gotham he wants without having to do the lifting himself. Dent has to be destroyed, because otherwise, Batman gets away with it.
And of course, Dent supports Batman. So, he’s democratic and lawful when it is to his purposes, nothing more.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Sure, I can certainly the logic of what you’re saying. Like I said below, I don’t think Nolan has an straightforward interpretation of the last shot of the movie so I’m not going that far in trying to interpret it, other than to say that it fried my brain.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
and like I said
I think the greatest strength of the movie is that you can watch it:
a) with my intrepretation
b) as a straightforward science-fiction heist movie with a bass-motherfucking-ass gimbel fight in the middle
c) as if the whole thing is Cobb’s complicated dream
d) with Adriande as Mal and the dream world as his old life, or something
e) tons of other ways
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
sure, i personally believe in B
but i wont deny that a case can be made for A, C, D, and E.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
maybe I misspelled?
The JGL fight scene in the hallway in the second dream level was done practically by rotating the set on a device called a gimbel. Which blows my mind anew every time I think about it. He didn’t use much stuntman work, either.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
and Sopranos isn't a good parallel
With Sopranos, it’s very clear what happens. He eats at a dinner and then the show ends. What happens then is subject to far fetched speculation. Maybe he gets shot. Maybe they all break into dance like Dirty Dancing. Who knows, who cares. People can’t accept that ending because it’s mundane and they have a stupid notion about how a show ends. In Inception, the totem starts to wobble and whether it falls or not has important implications. There is no totem equivalent in the Sopranos.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Well, no, we're not going to get started on the Sopranos
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
that's probably for the best
Because I hated the ending and hated people’s reactions to it from the defenders and haters.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
I find movies with various interpretations to them
to be the best types of movies. I love being able to revisit from a totally different angle.
That said, I don’t think it was just a straightforward heist “one last job, I just want my kids back” type of film. I think that that’s removing a lot of the thematic qualities to it and just watching it as a spectacle…like Ocean’s Eleven. Which is fine. It totally works on that level if that’s what you want. But for me there’s just an awful lot more going on, which you can read in a lot of different ways, and that is what makes the movie for me. Well, that and the spectacle.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Marion Cotillard won her Oscar playing Edith Piaf in La Vie en Rose...
…she was a French singer.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
The song they use as timing
isn’t that Edith Piaf?
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Yep
“Non, je ne regrette rien” is the song, which is important thematically, as is the name Ariadne.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Ariadne helps Theseus find his way through the maze to kill the minotaur
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Does anybody realize we can all talk trash about mods here until they watch the movie?!
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
this is meant in jest in case it isn't clear.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
BANNED
I saw the movie opening night. With a member of the cast, no less.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
ha ha. that wouldn't been nice.
It was Dileep Rao, who played Yusuf, the chemist (and van driver). He’s a friend from grad school.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
*would've
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
On a side note
his character really got stuck with the worst job. Not that it matters or anything.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
where did you find share information?
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
In the movie, I mean
His character got Dom’s share of the job. I meant his character probably was fine with the shittied job because a) he was in dreamland the shortest amount of time (being at the top level) and b) he got two shares. I have no idea what sort of compensation he got as an actor.
ahh. gotcha.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
you may also have seen him
in Drag Me To Hell and Avatar.
He’s on quite a run. :)
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
I remember him in Avatar
(What a shit movie, right?)…… he played the friendly scientist guy.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 8:58 PM EDT up reply actions
Yup, that was him.
And yeah. I thought Avatar was genius to look at, but man that script was a clunker. Ugh.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
And if I may
It was more a video game than a film. No real cinematography involved.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 9:02 PM EDT up reply actions
You may
It was a stunning film. But it was also deeply flawed.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
That was my point all along
Avatar = awesome feast for the eyes, kind of boring for the mind. I loved it nonetheless. I actually think I’ll see the special edition when it is released in august. In 3D, of course.
there's a special edition that's being released in Aug? barf.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
pretty dam cool
didn’t know you were an actor. the poor chemist got stuck on the 1st level, but he had an important job. i liked him in it. i liked everyone in it, actually.
Heh
I didn’t mean to make you post that. Just trying to be funny.
I’m glad your friend is having success. He was quite good in Inception. I don’t remember him from Avatar, but I don’t remember much from that movie besides my brain turning to angry goo.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Heh.
My favorite part of watching Dileep’s star rise was this article from the Playlist:
Who’s That Guy On The Inception Poster?
First of all, the first of the “Inception” posters featured a mysterious figure at the back alongside the more recognizable line-up of Leonardo Di Caprio, Ken Watanabe, Ellen Page, Joseph Gordon-Levitt and Tom Hardy.
It’s like, “You’ve made it! People are trying to figure out who the hell you are!”
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
As I read this, I recalled how much I despise trailers
I mean, they showed what was in the vault for Christ sakes. I refuse to ever watch another trailer again.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Damn, I love trailers
they are an art unto themselves. Check out this list:
50 Greatest Movie Trailers of All Time
Not that I necessarily agree (that Spider-Man trailer really has not aged well, and it’s only been 10 years), but there are a lot of great ones there. I love me a good trailer.
An extra doesn’t count Z you name dropper.
And more importantly, did you see the Cobb’s totem fall during the movie (I’m not talking about the end)?
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
yes, i saw it fall,
but I think that proves nothing. He could be dreaming that he spun it instead of actually spinning it in the dream. right?
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
He could be dreaming that he spun it instead of actually spinning it in the dream. right?
I think that undermines that whole purpose of having a totem no? If you could dream that you used totem thus negating the validity of the results, then why have a totem?
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
The totem tells you you're not in someone else's dream
because they wouldn’t know how it should behave. It doesn’t tell you if you’re dreaming or awake though. At least, that’s how I see it.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
According to the article I posted below, “We learn very early on that the one unimpeachable way to know whether or not you’re in a dream world or the real world is to test your totem,” so that suggests it suppose to tell if you’re in ANY dream, yours or another’s person. But maybe you’re right because that does sound familiar. And that would clear up my concern. I need to see that movie again.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
I didn't read the article,
but that makes no sense at all.
The point of the totem is that someone else doesn’t know the unpredictable way it would react. So if you were being “incepted”, your totem would behave normally instead of weirdly, tipping you off that you’re in someone else’s dream.
It makes no sense that in your own dream, the totem wouldn’t behave in its unpredictable way: I mean, you know it’s weighted funny or whatever, so why wouldn’t you dream that as well?
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
i dunno
seems to sorta defeat the purpose, though. i mean, they seemed in control anyway, no matter whose dream they were in. they didn’t control all the props, the “projections”, but they controlled what they created and had under their control. it would lose a lot of purpose if it was simply to tell if you were in someone else’s dream. you could still never be sure it was real.
It makes no sense that in your own dream, the totem wouldn’t behave in its unpredictable way: I mean, you know it’s weighted funny or whatever, so why wouldn’t you dream that as well?
Although in thinking about this more, a totem is unnecessary in your own dream because you can usually tell if you’re in your own dream eventually. In my experiences, I know I’ve been dreaming and I can’t tell I’m dreaming but eventually something happens that tips me off. But you’re right, a totem wouldn’t work in your dream. A totem would only be an indicator of your subconscious desire to be a dream, not actually if you’re in a dream.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
right at the top of the movie,
they point out to some guy that he isn’t in X’s dream, he’s actually in Y’s dream. So it’s not always clear whose dream you’re in, and obviously folks can be pulled into one another’s dreams.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Yeah, I don’t get how a guy could not know which dream he’s in unless he forgets or is tricked. I mean they need to hook into a machine while the person you’re entering is sleeping. You should know whose dream you’re entering by virtue of that fact.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
that was the point that I had forgotten
That it told you that you were in someone else’s dream, not just a dream in general.
you don't need a totem to tell you that you're in somebody's else dream
It’s not you accidentally walk into somebody dream.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Maybe not accidentally
but Cillian Murphy was in Yusef’s dream and thought it was real life, and then was in Arthur’s dream but thought he was in his own dream. So you can be sedated by a drug in a drink and then be led to believe that you are in your own dream, when in fact you are in someone else’s dream. That would be a good time to have a totem, just to be sure.
Cillian Murphy was in Yusef’s dream and thought it was real life,
I thought Cillian Murphy was in the chemist’s dream (can’t remember his name) and thought it was his father’s assistant dream.
And I must say I really liked the bit about how Cillian Murphy’s mind had been militarized. Great piece of detail.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
I thought Cillian Murphy was in the chemist’s forger’s dream (can’t remember his name) and thought it was his father’s assistant dream.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
See link below
I don’t remember exactly, so I’m taking the infographic at face value, but it appears that the characters stay behind in their own dream, which would make the top level Yusef’s dream (he stayed and drove the van) and the next level was JGL’s dream (he stayed in the hotel and fought in zero G).
The NEXT level is the forger’s dream, and Cillian Murphy is led to believe he’s in Tom Berenger’s dream. That’s the snow fortress level, and the lowest level, right above pure subconscious.
, which would make the top level Yusef’s dream (he stayed and drove the van)
I don’t get how they entered the dreams of someone “awake.” Ugh, my head hurts.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
to clarify
everyone falls asleep on the plane and they go into Yusuf’s, the chemist, dream. It’s raining, and Eames remakrs about how Yusuf should have gone to bathroom before takeoff, and Yusuf replies that there was too much champagne to drink (which was a wonderful detail, really).
Then everyone but Yusuf sleeps in the van in Arthur’s dream (the hotel), which is why when Arthur’s body gets wet and weightless, gravity and rain start changing rapidly in the hotel.
Then they go into Fischer’s dream via his fake godfather (not to be confused with Eames) which is the snow fortress.
Also, the only time they showed the top not toppling was in the bathroom (Saito walks in and startles Cobb, who picks up the top before it stops spinning) and at the very end (and of course, in the dreams themselves).
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
They were all asleep on the plane
On the plane, they all entered Yusef’s dream. Then in the van, they all entered JGL’s dream. Then in the hotel, they all entered the forger’s dream.
no it was fischer's dream
Adriadne even confusedly asks “Wait, whose dream are we going into now?” and Cobb says “Fischer’s”. They were technically going into his dream uncle’s dream, but that was just a projection of what he thought his uncle to be in the first dream level.
Fuck, this movie is impossible to explain after the fact.
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
Ah yeah I remember
That makes, sense, because they were trying to fool Fischer’s subconscious projections and lure then away from the fortress, but then for some reason, Saito’s injury made Fischer subconsciously suspicious? Is that why the hummer and the ski dudes turned around?
no, they sent Eames out after them
and also Cobb and Adriadne moved position so they everyone in the team was in or near the fortress. It’s alos possible that Mal alerted them, who knows?
Hang onto me, baby, and let's hope the roof stays on
I'll have to see it again
with a pad full of questions from this thread so I can look for specific answers. I thought the subconscious projections that were chasing down Cobb and his group turned around after Fischer noticed that Saito (whom he believed was just a projection of his subconscious) was dying.
right
every dream level they entered was fischer’s (cillian murphy). he was drugged on the plane, they all joined his dream.
again in the van, with his security projections coming after them, they all joined his dream for the 2nd level.
and then they told him they were joining berenger’s dream, but since berenger was simply a projection of himself, they entered a 3rd level of his dream.
they had to be in his dreams in order to plant an idea in his head, i.e. inception.
and damn straight I'm gonna drop names.
it’s half the fun of being an actor.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
psssh
Only in your dreams.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 5:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Another point:
The soundtrack was decent, and I thought it picked up during, the falling van sequence. Mind Heist showed up when JGL blasted the Elevator, I thought that whole scene was very well done.
Bring back Andino.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 19, 2010 7:25 PM EDT reply actions
I really can't say anything that hasn't been said.
But I really didn’t think it was better than The Dark Knight. Maybe cause TDK was my most anticipated movie ever in the history of all times and it exceeded expectations, but I just didn’t think Inception was better. Still a 10/10, still the best movie of the year, and still a masterpiece.
Also, the acting in TDK was great, and I don’t think any performance really came close in Inception.
"Amber has quick hands." ~ Joe Angel, 4/8/10
The only good acting in TDK was Ledger
And I don’t like any of Nolan’s stuff. Haven’t seen Inception, but I don’t find anything deep in his films. Masterpiece? I find it hard to believe that Nolan could create a masterpiece. Maybe he did, but I doubt it. Go watch “The Kids Are All Right” and tell me what the best movie of the year is. It’s summer. Personally I think Toy Story 3 is in a tie with the aforementioned movie. But it’s still too early to tell.
I'm back. YAY SUMMER!
Um,
The Prestige is brilliant. Hands down. There’s plenty deep in there too.
And Toy Story 3 was fine, but hardly the best film of the year. It was exactly what you expected it to be. Fun revisitation of all the same characters. But very predictable and a little too long.
Go see Winter’s Bone. THAT is the best movie I’ve seen this year. Haven’t seen TKAAR yet, it’s on my list.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Did David Goyer write the Prestige or was it Nolan?
I’ve seen it twice, just not recently.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Nolan co-wrote it with his brother,
based on the novel by Christopher Priest.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
i was just about to say that
looks like he wrote a lot of his movies with his brother. including memento, another brilliant (yes, i’m using that term, dco’sfan) film.
+100
Memento is outright genius.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Watch this and Insomnia right before Inception
I loved memento, It shows all you need is three good actors, a car, and a great story to make a great movie. No 3d Wonder Garden bullshit. cough Avatar cough
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 9:09 PM EDT up reply actions
wooops
That was the Dark Kinght
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 9:00 PM EDT up reply actions
Cyrus is still my fav movie of the year
“Please don’t fuck my mommy” is the best line of year.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
I haven't seen it yet.
Should I?
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
I've heard great things about Winter's Bone
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
it definitely fits your criteria for seeing something new
it’s a very different voice from what we often see these days.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
I haven't seen many movies this year, btw...
…and what I have seen I mostly haven’t liked.
But the two things I have seen that I’d recommend are “Chloe” by Atom Egoyan, and “Carlos”, Olivier Assayas’ 5 1/2 hour masterpiece about Carlos the Jackal.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
OK, Winter's Bone was AMAZING
Thank you for the rec.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
I saw Winter's Bone
It was brilliant. I saw it since then so I agree with you. I honestly hope it wins BP.
I'm back. YAY SUMMER!
Memento is awesome
Period. End of discussion.
"I might know something you don't know. 'Cause I've already been young, but you ain't never been old." - Elvin Bishop
this coves the flaws of TDK pretty well
although keep in mind I liked it too. these are a lot of the moments that made me go “really?” and, at the edited script, lol.
That is hilarious!
"I might know something you don't know. 'Cause I've already been young, but you ain't never been old." - Elvin Bishop
I didn't ban you :)
"I might know a couple things that you don't know. 'Cause I've been young, but you ain't never been old." - Elvin Bishop
in an attempt to bring this back on topic...
it should be clear to all of us now that the 4-game sweep of the rangers was a mirage, no less than the sweep of the bosox earlier in the year. it was like a dream come true, but it couldn’t last. it wasn’t reality.
i think someone got into our dreams as O’s fans and tried to plant an idea there: that the O’s were any good and could actually sweep playoff-caliber teams. and they almost pulled it off. the problem is, the idea wasn’t natural to us. it grew artificially before our eyes, but even as we saw it, we didn’t really believe it. it was just a dream. we knew it was. the inception failed.
I saw this review on Cinematical.
We learn very early on that the one unimpeachable way to know whether or not you’re in a dream world or the real world is to test your totem; an item whose behavior only a single individual can identify and predict. In the case of Cobb, it’s his wife’s spinning top. Arthur’s is a single loaded dice. Ariadne’s is a precisely weighted chess piece. But what is the audience’s totem?
What event in Inception is the audience aware of that no one else can know? There isn’t one. There’s no point in which reality is clearly and unimpeachably established.
After “waking up” we see Cobb in the bathroom, splashing his face with cold water and then spinning his totem. However, he’s interrupted before he/us can see whether or not the top falls over.
Man, this is driving me nuts. I could have sworn I saw Cobb’s totem fall at this scene or some other point. I need to see this movie again.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Im gonna see it next week in LA
You live in LA right?
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions
Orange County which is right outside of LA.
Does anybody remember if they saw Cobb’s totem fall at one point?!! This is driving me nuts!
Welcome to LALA land.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
It fell
in a very short scene in his apartment. He is holding a gun to his head and slowly puts it down when he sees it fall.
by lhartmoynihan on Jul 28, 2010 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions
No,
He picked it up while it was spinning when he heard someone come in.
"Amber has quick hands." ~ Joe Angel, 4/8/10
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0081036/
Something you should all check out, It’s pretty low budget and from the 80’s but you can get it on Netflix and it isn’t as deep as Inception, but deals with dreams, it is still good.
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 21, 2010 9:07 PM EDT reply actions
Ursula Le Guin, who wrote the novel that's based on...
…is one of the better sci-fi authors out there. The Left Hand of Darkness is particularly good.
To be understood is to be a prostitute. ~ Fernando Pessoa
Awesome book
It actually took me a few tries to start reading it – at first I was turned off by the writing style – but once I sat down and got through the first ten or so pages, I read it straight to the end.
Haven’t seen the 80s version, but the recent made-for-cable version with James Caan is (in my opinion) awful.
I have The Dispossessed just sitting on my Kindle, waiting to be read. It’s been there for months. Should I start reading it immediately?
Another point maybe only I'm interested in
Date for this movie? When does it take place? Near future? Today, but slightly different reality?
yes, you may take a date
oh, you mean as in what year… i don’t think they said, did they? i assumed near future.
there's not an exact date given in the movie
You just have to go with near future.
Don't mess with the bull, young man. You'll get the horns.
Okay just saw this....
Blew my fucking mind.
"I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it." -duck
Just saw it today. Loved it.
I’m gonna just take it for what it was, a good movie, and not delve to far into it. Other than the very end I think it was pretty straight forward. Obviously the spinning top at the end is being talked about, but what about the fact that his children were exactly the same as he had pictured them the entire movie? I think it was pretty obvious that he was still dreaming, but at the point he walked away from the top he did just as his wife did when she locked it away and decided that he doesn’t care anymore. This would be his reality whether it was real or not.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on Jul 31, 2010 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Just my two cents.
Insert something witty here.
by Knubles and Bits on Jul 31, 2010 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Who else saw this?
Bring back Tillman.
by WestcoastO'sFan on Jul 31, 2010 11:15 PM EDT reply actions
Just saw it tonight
and although her role is getting panned for the most part, I want to declare my eternal love for Marion Cotillard!
And I have to agree with Knubles and Bits a few posts above.
"Yeah, well, you know, that's just, like, your opinion, man." ~ The Dude
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