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Offseason OT: Homeland Finale (Spoilers)

Since we have a lot of Homeland watchers here. DISCUSS!


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Really good job with that finale.

I considered it extremely unlikely that he was going to take the one-way trip, to the extent that I would have been about as shocked as any show twist has ever really shocked me. But even considering that, they did a good job selling the tension. I knew (on a meta level) that something would intervene to keep him from doing it at the last minute. The show kept it tense until the intervention happened, though.

Really great work by all involved. And now the long con for season 2.

Do you think Carrie will be back or do you think she’s been zapped out of existence as far as the plot’s concerned?

"So I said, 'Looks like they've finally got Ogea in the pen. I wonder if the glove fits.' I thought I was going to get fired." - Mike Flanagan, RIP

by Eat More Esskay on Dec 19, 2011 1:58 AM EST reply actions  

I would be suprised if they took her out of it in a big way.

I too was very pleased with the finale. I thought they found that oh so perfect balance between solving the problems of season 1 while still setting up season 2. As you pointed out, it was unlikely he was going to blow himself up, but the tension was great. When Walker starts looking through his sights you realize, ok, something is actually about to go down. Using the gunshots to pass the metal detectors was pretty damn smart. Big thumbs up to all the writers and actors, even CD.

When Andino finally emerged, he looked up at the Red Sox fans filing out. "I just wanted to see them go," he says

by WestcoastO'sFan on Dec 19, 2011 4:29 AM EST up reply actions  

If they pushed her out of the show

Even a little, I will be so angry. Amazing finale. But the whole cukoo’s nest they think you are crazy when you aren’t bothers me so much. (haven’t actually read cuckoo’s but I believe this is the premise?) Its a great plot but I can’t stand it because I have grown to like her character. She makes this show.
Is it bad I wanted to see all the imaginary people blow up just so she would be validated?

by mdterps0325 on Dec 19, 2011 5:28 AM EST up reply actions  

pouty face girl will definitely be back

her trying to remember the issa connection will take up a good chuck of episodes.

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Dec 19, 2011 12:51 PM EST up reply actions  

why you hatin?

you’d be pouty too if you were smarter than the room and they all thought you were crazy

by mdterps0325 on Dec 19, 2011 1:08 PM EST up reply actions  

i love carrie the character. i just don't like claire danes.

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Dec 19, 2011 1:46 PM EST up reply actions  

quick thoughts

I’m not sure how much longer the cat and mouse game between Brody and Carrie will remain interesting without becoming redundant. I was sort of hoping for some resolution with brody blowing himself up or outing himself.

Last week’s preview sort of ruin the funed of the bomb scene. Since I saw Brody and Walker share screen time and that hadn’t happened it, it was obvious that Brody would walk out alive.

Love the finale overall. Brody capping Walker and Brody’s daughter talking him off the ledge were awesome.

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Dec 19, 2011 2:29 PM EST reply actions  

Best part of the show
the cat and mouse game between Brody and Carrie will remain interesting without becoming redundant.

So many avenues this show can go down. I am interested to see how much detective work Brody’s daughter ends up doing as she gets more clues into her fathers new psyche.

One thing I read in a review was how that confession tape will surface in the coming seasons. I mean somebody has to have a copy of it right!?

by IggesRule13 on Dec 21, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm surprised that they at least didn't reveal who is the mole in the CIA

My money’s on Galvez, based entirely on “TV Logic”. He’s a minor character that we don’t see for episodes at a time, but he’s there often enough that we remember him.

by Chanumas on Dec 20, 2011 5:19 PM EST reply actions  

also

Did brody really slip a razor? then why did saul fail the polygraph at first

by mdterps0325 on Dec 24, 2011 5:56 PM EST up reply actions  

What a terrific finale!

I finally saw it last night. I have to say that in addition to outstanding acting, particularly by Damian Lewis and Many Patinkin, the show is superbly written and shot. The composition of the scenes feels much mroe like film than television.

I think Danes gets a little too histrionic, but the role may be written that way. Her “manic” session also seemed really urealistic (at least based on the few bipolar people i’ve met—more caricature than grounded in reality—but again, that may be the script. Overall, she’s doing incredible work in a very difficult and range-y role.

It will be interesting to see if they can keep all this tension for a second season. The set-p has been nice, but if it devolves into just being the “Brady-vs-Kerrie with Saul as referee” show, it will fail. They are going to have to get some new characters in there. Walker’s death was kind of predictable, and alo a shame. Great character, and it would have been fun to have him lurking in the edges of scenes for another few episodes at least.

Overall, awesome show, looking forward to season 2. We subscribed to Showtime for the very first time this year, and this was the show that did it for us.

"End of season like this, to make Boston go home sad, crying, I’ll take it all day."—Robert Andino

by zknower on Dec 21, 2011 12:21 PM EST reply actions  

my problems

1. It is not believable that Walker would be used solely as a mechanism to get Brody inside. He had a clear shot at the V.P. Why not take out the highest value target rather than rely only on the conviction of a suicide bomber. Walker could have taken out at least two high value targets and many random others and Brody would have still been afforded entry into the saferoom to carry out his suicide mission.

2. The thematic element “who is the real terrorist, Abu nazir or the Vice president” comes off a little to blatantly for me. The vice president indiscriminantly bombs a school of 80 some children and Abu Nazir uses precision to take out explicit military targets. Is it really an act of terror if Nazir is taking out precision targets? Carrie’s driving instinct is that a lone sniper taking out 2-5 targets is not Nazir’s calling card. But taking out fifteen targets is?

3. Brody better be dealing with some major demons next season. He just shot his former best friend in cold blood in order to save his own neck.

by snotboogie on Dec 28, 2011 7:12 PM EST reply actions  

It is not believable that Walker would be used solely as a mechanism to get Brody inside. He had a clear shot at the V.P. Why not take out the highest value target rather than rely only on the conviction of a suicide bomber.

Yup, good point. Although probably would not have gone ahead as the suicide bomber if the VIP was already out. But I don’t think Abu Nazir would care about that.

Brody better be dealing with some major demons next season.

Next season? He’s already fucked up now!

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Dec 28, 2011 7:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Just saw the finale

1. Carrie stays, o’ course. It’s complicated to keep her in the CIA, but that’s who she is. Carrie as an out-patient w/ occasional bursts of prescience isn’t much of a show. And basically no Carrie, no Homeland, y’axe me.

2. The brain-frying adds a new wrinkle to the plot (as well as her cerebellum). You can go in several directions w/ it, one of them that it proves an effective treatment — a nicely counter-intuitive twist — which helps re-qualify her for work in the above institution. But to make that REALLY believable…

3. She’s gotta be vindicated. Nazir, whom Saul now sees she “got right”, is not enough; she’s gotta be proven right on Brody, too. But that compromises (or at least steeply downgrades) the career paths of both the VP and Estes, of course. Gee, too bad for them.

4. So Brody has to get found out (no doubt via the Issa connection) and has to abandon his get-close-to-power plan after 2 or 3 episodes. What to do w/ him then? You COULD make him the new Walker, the elusive on-the-ground weapons guy. But I doubt that can be sustained. And w/o Brody — just like w/o Carrie — there’s no Homeland.

So yeah, after the first third of season 2 things seem to me kind of in a bind plot-wise. Which is why I’ve never made a dime writing movie plots. Great series, in any case, immediately entering my Top 10 list.

p.s. Agree on the CIA mole: Galvez all the way, both for Chanumas’s “structuralist” rationale above and for his built-in explanation— the “split personality” background.

We still suck, but on Sept. 29, 2011, we did a Very Cool Thing. Yeah, we did that.

by Titov on Jan 4, 2012 7:05 PM EST reply actions  

regarding #4

I’m very interested to see what they’ll do with Brody. I don’t think this cat and mouse game can sustain the show much longer. They could focus on the rehabilitation of Brody but I doubt that’ll happen. I think it’s more likely that he’ll be replaced with a new nemesis for Carrie.

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Jan 5, 2012 3:11 AM EST up reply actions  

I'm kind of afraid you're right, meaning he's prolly gotta go...but along w/ him goes the principle dramatic tension

of the series. He’s a one-man, three-level confrontation: there’s Brody v. Carrie, a uniquely complex and powerful dynamic in the annals of TV drama, it seems to me; then there’s Brody v. Dark Side America’s Politicos (the VP and Estes, to the extent that he’s a henchman/co-conspirator); and there’s Old Brody v. New Brody, i.e. the traditional Marine and the post-POW “enlightened” version, the latter a wonderfully complicated figure that many American TV watchers will (do) need to ponder from about 5 diff angles to get their minds around…and that may not be enough.

Major kudos to D. Lewis, of course, for holding this all together for so long and so believably. I think C. Danes likewise deserves big pts for making a bipolar/manic depressive so engaging; she’s not OTT w/ the symptoms (in my view) and makes the character sympathetic w/o softening or sentimentalizing her. She impressed me, btw, in Shopgirl, from which I felt she had some real range she could show later. As I think she is now.

We still suck, but on Sept. 29, 2011, we did a Very Cool Thing. Yeah, we did that.

by Titov on Jan 5, 2012 9:27 AM EST up reply actions  

I didn’t think of Brody in that but that’s brilliant and spot on. But I can’t Claire Danes. She has same damn face for everything! Sad Carrie? Danes put on a constipated look. Maniac Carrie? Danes put on a constipated look. Have sex Carrie? Danes put on a constipated look. Rinse, wash, and repeat.

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Jan 5, 2012 1:15 PM EST up reply actions  

She's going to spend half of next season trying to remember that Brody knew Issa.

When she actually remembers, she’s going to spend the rest of the season trying to convince everyone that she remembers Brody knew Issa. Everyone, including Saul, is going to take it as a symptom of her brain frying.

Regarding number 4, I think the kid is going to play a large role in Brody being discovered. She might not be convinced right now, but she’s sorta got it in the back of her mind. I actually think she’s going to be the reason Brody doesn’t actually commit any attacks. Somebody, possibly Carrie, is going to convince him that his own daughter is more important than the kid of some f**ked up terrorist.

I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck

by twistedlogic on Jan 5, 2012 9:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Agree that trying-to-remember-Brody-knew-Issa is -- or will be presented as -- a major plot device

But the extent to which it works (i.e. builds tension, advances the story) depends on how seriously the Agency (beyond Saul) takes Carrie…which has to be Not Very as long as she’s an out-patient BP sufferer w/ a history of shock treatment. So we’re back to the question: How to get Carrie back into Langley (believably)?

Also agree that the kid — and M. Saylor’s doing a great job, btw, of humanizing and individualizing the passive-aggressive-difficult-suburban-teenager stereotype — will be critical in the Brody outing. Much more than Mom, natch, who has gained some new depth, yeah, but will likely never be of real use plot-wise.

Y’know what’d be nice? If the Brody family were sitting around watching TV some time (which we’ve seen them do on several occasions) and on the screen we suddenly note that the show they’re watching is…an episode of Breaking Bad. The show (on their TV) ends, and the son starts things off with, “Wow, so the Dad has this whole other Secret Life, huh …”

We still suck, but on Sept. 29, 2011, we did a Very Cool Thing. Yeah, we did that.

by Titov on Jan 5, 2012 9:48 AM EST up reply actions  

And speakin' o' which, let's get going already w/ the new season of Breaking Bad!

Talk about interesting dynamics! There are many in BB, of course, but as a former h.s. teacher I have to say that the complex relationship between Walt and Jesse, w/ its many mixed elements — good/bad, admirable/deplorable, affectionate/loathing — is one principal reason the show succeeds, for my money anyway.

The two are eternally trapped in a residual teacher-student relationship (note how JP ALWAYS refers to WW as “Mr. White”, both directly and when talking to 3rd persons) and yet are forced to deal with each other outside that dynamic too, of course, as adults who by turns complicate, endanger and save each other’s lives. In short, they’re like the multi-dimensional characters in a Coen Bros. movie: you can never predict how these two are going to deal w/ each other the next time we meet them.

The Pinkman role, btw, was apparently originally plotted as a two-episode thing— but can you imagine BB w/o him?
(Saul Goodman was also cast as a short-termer, it seems, but was such an immediate and major hit w/ the audience that they had to write him into more— into the whole series, in fact.)

We still suck, but on Sept. 29, 2011, we did a Very Cool Thing. Yeah, we did that.

by Titov on Jan 5, 2012 10:17 AM EST up reply actions  

I think the kid is going to play a large role in Brody being discovered. She might not be convinced right now, but she’s sorta got it in the back of her mind. I actually think she’s going to be the reason Brody doesn’t actually commit any attacks.

Yeah, that’s a damn good point.

Kevin Gregg-"You obviously haven't acquired my taste for pitching yet"

by birdman on Jan 5, 2012 1:13 PM EST up reply actions  

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