Pondering FanPosts
A discussion has started in the comments of the most recent FanPost regarding the very nature of FanPosts, and how unfortunate it is that their production has dwindled of late.
Those of you who were around a few summers ago remember when we got the first influx of Yahoo posters, and while some of them fit right in, a lot of them didn't understand our community and didn't try to understand our community. A lot of horrible, terrible, no-good FanPosts started popping up, and something had to be done. This is when zknower, duck, and I wrote the Community Guidelines.
If you've ever read the CGs, you know that the section on FanPosts is pretty detailed. The decision to try and flesh out exactly what a FanPost should be was taken very seriously as a response to the drivel that had begun showing itself in that section. I stand by what we did because at the time it was necessary.
Since then, however, the output of FanPosts has really dried up, something that I often think is very sad. This community is very smart and has a lot to say, and while a lot of good baseball discussion does happen in the daily open thread, it's mixed in with conversations about food and Star Wars and politics. That can be intimidating to new posters and an inconvenience to anyone who wants to talk baseball but doesn't have the luxury of following along for most of the day.
Upon looking over FanPosts of the past, it seems that our folly was in trying to give too much structure to what a FanPost should be (although our intentions were noble, I swear). But there is no right or wrong way to create a FanPost, as long as that FanPost isn't idiotic. There are fantastic analytic FPs, creative FPs, off-topic FPs, humorous FPs, FPs about memories, even FPs to introduce yourself or talk about how old you are.
So, a challenge to you all. I know you have good stuff to talk about, and I know you have valid opinions. So if you think of something baseball related that you want to talk about, create a FanPost.The only thing you need to ask yourself is, "Is this something that would be of value to the community?" If the answer is yes, go for it.
A second challenge, should you choose to accept, is to restrain yourself from the knee-jerk reaction of jumping all over somebody if they post something that isn't right in line with the general CC way of thinking. Disagree, by all means, but don't be a jerk about it. I would actually like it if we had people come here and feel welcome. And I've been as guilty of this as others in the past, so it's something I'm going to work on myself.
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I’d like to see a feature on this site – FanPost Hall of Shame. The worst ones, to me, are still pretty amusing and should live in posterity on the front page, or an easily found tab. Might even discourage the Os21Girls and Nattyohs of the world.
by brek on Mar 16, 2011 10:18 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Now that would definitely encourage more people to post…
"It’s easy to lie with statistics, but it’s easier to lie without them." -Fred Mosteller
by John Stephens on Mar 16, 2011 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions
I really want to see some of them...
anybody have a link?
Get 'em.
you are NOT a beautiful or unique snowflake.
Music City Miracles Hall Of Fame, Class of 2010
by danielreese05 on Mar 16, 2011 11:36 PM EDT up reply actions
stacey this is the best orioles blog
it will be great again. i have some plans for some fanposts myself. I remember when we didn’t really have open threads, just a bunch of fanposts.
I was thinking the other day that I actually liked the fanpost-centric format better than the open threads. I still read probably 40% of open threads, but as someone who does not really contribute a lot of comments, I have been reading them less and less.
you know what might work, just as an idea… is to close the open thread for comments at a certain time, or not have an open thread on certain days.
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
i am typing with one hand today because i hurt my wrist
The stock market will never recover, our armies will never again be #1, and our children will drink filthy water for the rest of their lives - HST
by the fix is in on Mar 16, 2011 10:20 AM EDT up reply actions
holy shit
you’re derrek lee?
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
I was going to mention this, but you've done it for me.
My memory is that after we wrote the CG, there were still a fair number of Fanposts—we really just sifted out the crappiest ones.
What was more responsible for the Fanposts drying up was the daily Open Threads. Especially when the OTs began to have QOTDs in them. The types of things that have come up for QOTD are exactly the sorts of things that used to have Fanposts written about them.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
I think it was a combination
of the OTs plus people being all “this isn’t what the guidelines state a FanPost should be!” the second someone wrote something.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
yeah I agree
too many deputy blog cops.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
I did this a couple times
and apologize.
(Bows head, surrenders the plastic badge he’d made for himself)
Like a bad, suave dude. You know what I'm sayin'. COOL. SC 7/24/08
Bird Droppings too...
…A lot of the old FanPosts used to be people linking to and discussing articles from other sources. Bird Droppings has done away with that wholesale. Now there are benefits to aggregation too of course. But one side effect is we’re not getting individuals’ FanPosts about other sources’ material on the club and what is discussed about some of the material is not as in depth as it used to be. We used to have line by line dissection of shitty articles or good ones. But we don’t really have that anymore.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
If people want to discuss individual article in depth in FanPosts that's certainly fine with me
But what was happening, and one of the reasons we decided to have BD in the first place, was that people didn’t have a destination to discuss the news of the day. FanPosts weren’t being created for that, so if someone came to CC and the latest post was last night’s gamethread or last night’s recap, that’d be it for us for the day. BD has its drawbacks, but it has been a boon to this community.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
Personally
I think I would like it more if there were less articles in Bird Droppings with a little more editorial oomph and purpose to each one. A lot of times it seems like BD is just going through the motions. Like it’s a job you guys are just trying to get done – and that’s obviously not so compelling to read. I mean there is an art to aggregation. Take a look at Drudge or HuffPo. They do the news but they each have a clear voice, and an agenda, which comes through. I don’t always feel that with BD.
But I know it’s also a lot of work, so if there were less articles linked that might take some burden off. Then a little more encouragement for people to pick up other news sources to analyze in the FanPosts could push other voices to give their analyses over there. And voila….depth, diversity of opinion, easy access to information.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
Do you want to volunteer to get up at the crack of dawn and do that?
I mean, I get what you’re saying, but we all have full time jobs and it takes long enough to do what we do without reading every single piece of news, determining which ones fit our agenda, and posting only those.
When I do BD I don’t post every bit of news I come across, but I just don’t have the time nor the inclination to double the amount of time I put in before I get to work in the morning.
I wish more than anything I could dedicate more time to Camden Chat and make it exactly what we all want it to be, but there are only so many hours in the day and I have a job and other commitments.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
for real, dude?
Drudge & HuffPo = paid employees who curate headlines for profit.
CC = ENTIRELY VOLUNTARY EFFORT.
get a little perspective.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
also,
what you’re saying might apply to the regular season, when there are 10 different news sources covering brian’s back issues. but in the offseason, pulling together clips is quite a grind, as there is usually a dearth of orioles news.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Seriously - and this responds to Stacey above too...
Both of you need to stop being defensive. Right now. I am trying to help you, not criticize you, and I expect you to recognize that and hopefully appreciate it. I recognize that it takes time and I said as much in my comment. I do not have all the answers. Far from it. Simply ideas that I’m throwing around.
Now with that said….the goal here should always be toward quality. This is now the top blog that covers the team. It’s well positioned and we should be looking to improve and expand on that even more. But saying we don’t have time is not an acceptable excuse. Individuals don’t have time, sure. But there are so many people on here that could and would help. And yes Stacey, I am willing to wake up at the crack of dawn to do this, with others, if you guys are interested. I can’t do it every day. But my schedule is relatively flexible.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
I didn't think I was being defensive at all
I was merely stating facts. Individuals don’t have time, but groups of individuals do, you’re saying. Someone has to coordinate that group, and that someone is me. I’m not saying that in a defensive way or a micromanaging way, but it’s the truth. It’s taxing enough on me coordinating to make sure there is always a gamethread and a post game and an open thread and other articles.
I’m perfectly happy with what 2632 is providing for links, and I was perfectly happy with what duck provided for links. Yes, improvement is the goal, but I have no more time. Every single extra thing that happens on this blog takes time from me whether you believe that to be the case or not. Bird Droppings is very low on my list.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
I'm disturbed that I'm agreeing with JP
but here I am. And hey: I’ve never done the Bird Droppings before ever, so what would I know about anything, but I’d compare them to the Hardball Talk blog, which 99% of what it does is linking to and commenting on baseball articles. And it’s amazing.
Bird Droppings is great, because just having all of the Orioles-centric links in one place is wonderful, but it’s not even on the same field as HBT. And it doesn’t really try to be. Could it? Uh…I dunno, but that’d be pretty awesome.
Would it provide a larger opportunity for FanPosts? I don’t know about all that.
Free Chris Tillman!
I don't think it would be too much effort or redundancy
If someone wanted to create an fanpost discussing an article already listed in BD with some extra commentary for more thorough discussion. Post a comment in BD with a link to the fanpost and I think people would gladly migrate to that fanpost for discussion. BD can be for quick comments about articles and an off-topic thread for the regular discussions we have around here while reemphasizing fanposts. No extra work would really be put on any of the mods, besides may occasional frontpaging the occasional fanpost that might deserve the extra attention.
Yeah, good timing
I wrote what i have below while you were writing this.
Less big words and more exclamation marks
by Astronaut Mike Dexter on Mar 16, 2011 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
like what Titov did this very week re: Tom Boswell
although apparently people didn’t care to comment too much.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
That brings up a point...
There is only so much the mods can do to bring back some of that FanPost action from the past. The community here has gotten so focused on the OTs, that even though there have been some good FPs recently, they are largely ignored or are redundant because the topic has already been discussed.
I think Stacey writing this as basically a call to the CC community to embrace them again (and also noting that perhaps the guidelines laid out in CGs may have been too strict) will probably have some impact. We’ll see.
again, HBT is guys who get paid to write for HBT
I love HBT, it’s one of my favorite sites, but Craig Calcaterra and Aaron Gleeman aren’t rushing around to do those things while simultaneously trying to get ready for work and spend a few minutes with their boyfriend and eat breakfast and make sure there will be game thread that day.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
plus,
as Andrew himself pointed out, “99% of what [they do] is linking to and commenting on baseball articles”. If you’re only focusing on one type of content, then that content had better be pretty good.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Craig and Aaron share a boyfriend?
No, I get that it’s all hard work. I know all about that firsthand (or, at least, increasingly firsthand), but it would be a very cool thing to strive towards. None of my personal goals are what I would call necessarily realistic, and neither would that evolution of the blog. But it would enhance the overall Camden Chat Experience, if we could find a way to make something like that work in a realistic, easily consumed way.
Free Chris Tillman!
by the way
personal goals: visit the moon, somehow claim responsibility for the permanent downfall of the Yankees, become a better writer
Free Chris Tillman!
I understand
this is a personal conversation. One I don’t expect to have here or even at all. But my two cents is you should be getting paid something for this. Markos Moulitsas & Co. can’t be fighting for the working man on one hand and then having some slave army of bloggers on the other. If that is indeed how it’s going. I only can infer from innuendo.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
by Jonny Pops on Mar 16, 2011 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
In fairness
I do get paid. But the amount I get paid relative to the work I put in is next to nothing. It doesn’t affect my quality of life one bit.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
that's how it's going
Markos & Co have devised a brilliant business model, whereby thousands of devoted sports bloggers donate their free time to them.
The head of a blog (in this case Stacey) gets a very small monthly stipend, but it’s little more than a tip of the hat.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Union Time.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
And they pull a Wal-Mart
and close every blog that unionizes. :)
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
How could he?
He’d be finished. Honestly it’s probably a juicy story for Fox News right now.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
blogging isn't a money business
Bloggers don’t make a lot of money anywhere. If they’re affiliated with a big company (like HBT is) or if they work for an RSN or a newspaper, they might make enough to live on. No bloggers are making enough to settle into a cushy lifestyle, but the difference at SBN is more people are seeing our work because of the business doings of SBN. I wouldn’t be making money no matter where I was writing, and because SBN knows that, they don’t need to pay us.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
not necessarily true...
the family we bought our little Columbia townhouse from moved into a big “West” Columbia single-family home due to the enormous succes of the husband’s independent blog. It’s an incredibly narrow focused blog, but was named one of Time Mag’s top 25 Blogs and apparently rakes in a ton of money through ad sales.
well there are exceptions to every rule obviously
But for every guy who can afford a single family Howard County home there are a thousand very talented writers that no one will ever hear of.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
yeah,
I was really just bragging about how I know this guy, and he’s awesome, thereby making me a little bit more awesome.
and we are all a little more awesome for reading your words
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
people don't blog for money.
They do it because they are passionate about that topic. Although, ideally, maybe in the future, people like you and AG and the others will be making a living writing about the O’s and Peter Schmuck will be an unpaid moderator on OH.
Honestly...
….don’t write much more about this on here. You might regret it one day if your career doing this rises.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
well that's the extent of what I have to say about it
and it’s all very factual. I don’t have anything but appreciation for the fact that the big wigs have built a platform where my voice is heard by so many.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
Plus you get all the sweet MASN guest spots!
Well… on their website, anyway.
"You can always tell Yankees fans by the total vacancy which occupies the space where most other people have faces." - J. K. O'Toole (paraphrased)
by Eat More Esskay on Mar 16, 2011 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions
I'll be alternating between that
and “Name That Bread! Name That Ammo!”
Monkey! 22s!
Free Chris Tillman!
And I'll be the new voice of Esskay radio spots.
"You can always tell Yankees fans by the total vacancy which occupies the space where most other people have faces." - J. K. O'Toole (paraphrased)
by Eat More Esskay on Mar 16, 2011 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions
but I’d compare them to the Hardball Talk blog, which 99% of what it does is linking to and commenting on baseball articles. And it’s amazing.
This should be JP’s job. Instead of hunting for articles, have him find one article and then write up a few thoughts. Maybe 2-3 times a week? Keep BDs the same, but this would be a nice addition. Hell, I might be willing to do this once a week.
Folksy literate type.
Seriously,
disagreeing with you is not the same thing as “being defensive”. And a comment like, “A lot of times it seems like BD is just going through the motions. Like it’s a job you guys are just trying to get done – and that’s obviously not so compelling to read” is certainly criticism. Perhaps it’s meant to be constructive, but surely you know by now that your history on this blog is primarily that of a rabble-rouser.
Saying “we don’t have time” is a perfectly acceptable excuse. Writing as one who posted clipping threads for the better part of a year, making a quality thread takes time. Duck and Stacey know this even more than I. And while it may be a romantic notion that a bunch of readers will group together and share the responsibility, the fact is that coordinating that group and having the work be consistent would itself add a fair amount of time. It was hard enough to coordinate in the past with three (former) blog heads. Trying to coordinate it with 6 or 7 people might improve the overall experience, and it might not—but it would certainly add considerably to Stacey’s plate and that of her co-authors. I agree with her that there are other ways to tweak the site that would offer more bang for the buck.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Isn't it funny...
…how nobody ever admits to being defensive? Even when it’s as obvious as this is right now? So obvious you’ve stooped to name-calling with me, presumably to retaliate for your wounded ego, which, I know, I know you’ll never admit to having. Because how could you be subjective and defensive about anything? Please.
FYI, the guy who wrote the Bird Droppings for the last how many months isn’t getting defensive. He’s writing:
A lot of times it seems like BD is just going through the motions.
Guilty as charged.
That’s one of the reasons I gave it up. I found myself just copying and pasting and barely adding anything. I was just putting up articles because I thought I had to. I know BD has a purpose, and I eventually came to embrace the format, but by 2 weeks ago, I had neither the time nor the inclination to be witty for 30 minutes a day at O’Dark Early.
So you want to have a real conversation about this, or are you just going to keep licking your wounds and acting hurt? Seriously you disappointed me on this man. I expect more from you.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
and you show your true colors once again.
- me saying you’re a rabble-rouser on this blog is “name calling”? Now who’s being defensive?
- telling you to get perspective is not “being defensive”. It’s telling you to get perspective.
- I never once said the criticism wasn’t warranted. I said that it was criticism, after you said you hadn’t criticized us
This isn’t about my ego. I have plenty of history with wounded egos and am completely happy to admit when I’ve overstepped, or when I’m wrong, or whatever. This is not about me “licking my wounds” or whatever you’re imagining. This is not about me or about you.
This is about discussing solutions to a problem (or perceived problem) here at CC. And I’m not about to devolve into a flame war with you, irrespective of what you expect.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
* and I suspect...
….that you and I have different definitions of what “being defensive” is.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
I always show my true colors on here...
…with predictable results
Nice bullet points. Looks pretty flamey though. Despite your protestations and insistence to the contrary. And I especially liked that bit at the end, the last paragraph. It’s like Nixon went all the way to China in a single comment.
So yes, with that out of the way, let’s get back to talking turkey. And you bring up a decent point in your parentheses. Is this a problem or perceived problem? Personally I find myself glossing over the Bird Droppings and skimming them too often and thinking that more could be done with the front page. As I say it felt like the writer was going through the motions. The writer said he was going through the motions. This is not the end of the world. It still serves a purpose as links to other stories even if the analysis isn’t there. But still it has sort of a filler kind of feel to it. Perhaps something in the formatting could make it a little better too. Fonts, sizes, colors etc. An approach aggregator sites take to their links and headlines.
I’m just brainstorming now…feel free to jump in anybody…
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
skipping over the other stuff as well
part of the issue may be that Bird Droppings and Open Thread are combined. By being part of the open thread, the BDs are just an introduction to “your daily cup of coffee with fellow CCers.” I have no doubt that many folks don’t read a single link. But I also think two separate posts would be overkill.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Oh come on....
….that Nixon/China line was good. Although I have a nagging feeling I’ve used it before.
I don’t think the combination is necessarily a problem. As people are saying elsewhere on this thread, I think that there’s an unspoken kind of feeling that once a story is covered in BD it’s already been touched upon – so nobody is really discussing it further in FanPosts etc. If we just dispelled that notion, that might accomplish enough in and of itself.
I’m interested in what you brought up with the traffic on BD though. That’s obviously a big deal. Tell me more. Also I suppose it does help with the SEO.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
sorry, was gone a long while
before Open Threads (and Bird Droppings), traffic took a huge plunge after the playoffs every year. after BD/OT began, people began coming here every day, and multiple times per day as well. And the community grew enormously as a result of that.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
my quick two cents
You made a (great) suggestion to add fanposts which analyzes a single news article. The mods indicated that they do not have time. You responded with, “Stop being defensive.” I see not having enough time as being a perfectly reasonable response and not at all a defensive response. Like I said above, as long as the mods don’t mind, you should start doing these type of fanposts. In fact, I’d be willing to write these occasionally. I just don’t want to see BDs change in anyway.
Folksy literate type.
Okay...
…let’s not keep going over the defensive stuff. We’re getting stuck in the mud. We had some friction, hopefully it’s passed.
My original point was just that we used to analyze news articles in diaries and the fanposts all the time. I hardly see that at all anymore and I think BD has a part in discouraging it. I’m also not as into BD as you are, for reasons we’ve discussed. So if it was scaled back a bit, I wouldn’t mind, personally.
I just think overall we need more analyses than from just one or two people. News articles can be a nice bridge to that, where you can expound upon what someone has written already. Of course original stuff is needed as well.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
As far as I can tell, nobody is saying you can’t do what you want. In fact, Stacey embraced your idea when she said, “If people want to discuss individual article in depth in FanPosts that’s certainly fine with me.” As far as I can tell, nobody is really disagreeing here since you don’t want the analysis fanposts to replace bird droppings. It’s just a question of who wants to do it. Like I keep saying, go for it. Are you on board brother?
Folksy literate type.
Isn’t it funny how nobody ever admits to being defensive?
Come on dude, you have to admit that you get defensive occasionally.
Folksy literate type.
I absolutely do.
Sometimes irrationally so. No question. I thank you guys for putting up with it.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
"A lot of times it seems like BD is just going through the motions."
Guilty as charged.
That’s one of the reasons I gave it up. I found myself just copying and pasting and barely adding anything. I was just putting up articles because I thought I had to. I know BD has a purpose, and I eventually came to embrace the format, but by 2 weeks ago, I had neither the time nor the inclination to be witty for 30 minutes a day at O’Dark Early.
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
Exhibit A:
I rest my case.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
Crap, I just helped your argument
Stacey and zk, I take it all back! You’re right!!!!!
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
maybe i'll just hide this whole branch of the discussion. ;)
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
yeah, yeah...
..that horse ain’t going back in the barn. :P
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
well you win the internet then.
be the change you want to see in the world, JP
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
I'm sure 2632 would really appreciate the help
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
Sure
I don’t want to impose. But I’d be happy to help out.
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
Please don't change bird droppings!
I love having a bunch of O’s clippings in one spot. I don’t even bother going to the Baltimore Sun anymore because I know BD will filter out the bad stuff for me.
Folksy literate type.
by birdman on Mar 16, 2011 12:46 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Never fear.
I don’t think any of us would change up BD too much. It’s largely responsible for this site’s growth.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
shudder
I agree with Birdman – I really like the clippings.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
I'd hate to see Open Threads removed or be limited
I wasn’t around for the heyday of Fan Posts, but it seems pretty evident that the large and varied discussion topics in the OTs, combined with the numerous BD links have obsoleted FanPosts to an extent. However Open Threads have their place, and I believe are the crucial element that keeps people lurking around the blog until they decide to join. The reason this blog gets hundreds of hits per posting, more than most other blogs I’ve seen on SBN, is how varied the topics are. No matter what someone is interested in, sports, current events, arts, etc., it’s covered in some fashion every week in the OTs/BDs. No one really talks that much about off-topic things in other blogs, and their participation suffers for it.
Now, the O’s should absolutely be the central topic to this thread. This shouldn’t just be essentially a chat room in blog form. However, what makes CC a great blog and facilitates all the participation we enjoy is the camaraderie that has been built through non-O’s related discussions in the OTs. I love talking about the team and I feel that I contribute relevant conversation to any O’s-related topic, no matter how lofty or scientific the argument is. But there’s only so much Orioles talk I can do in one day, especially during the off-season. I’m not interested in putting Vlad and Moldy’s career stats into a matrix every day to determine who should get the maximum number of at bats in 2011 and how that would statistically affect the team into the 2013 season. I love how we spent half our time BS’ing about life and the other half dissecting the O’s in the daily threads, and the variance is what I feel attracts people.
Now, I understand that a lot of people feel that pertinent baseball-related discussions are lost in the 500+ comment OT’s each day. If someone comments on an article about playing time in the outfield in an open thread and there are 50 responses to it analyzing statistics and intangible values to veteran FA signings, this is essentially a FanPost that is sandwiched into the open thread. Perhaps the solution is this:
If a baseball-related conversation is started in a daily thread that becomes a well-thought out, structured argument with lots of community participation, maybe that string of the thread should be cut and pasted into a FanPost so that it will linger around the site on it’s own for a few weeks and can be discussed more in depth.
Less big words and more exclamation marks
by Astronaut Mike Dexter on Mar 16, 2011 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
i think...
there’s plenty of space for open threads and fanposts. going for a deeper read on something that is linked or discussed in cursory fashion in an OT is a totally appropriate fanpost, i’d think. while i agree that game threads, postgame writeups, etc. sort of obviate the need for extended open thread jams or, a pm open thread until opening day and/or on off days wouldn’t maybe might not be such a bad thing to keep comment flow manageable.
"the secret to a happy ending is knowing when to roll the credits"
by j.q. higgins on Mar 16, 2011 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
what's funny is,
this whole discussion was started by a crappy fanpost from someone who had registered for the site the day before.
I think we’re looking for more fanposts from the regular visitors to the site, because we know that they’ll usually be contributing a lot. So the question is less “are we scaring off the n00bs” and more “why don’t regular visitors feel inspired to write more fanshots?”
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
See Steve's comments below
Perhaps this is a just a lull in FanPosts as we all eagerly anticipate the start of the season. I have limited strong opinions about the team as of now. When the season starts I’ll be much more passionate about benching/murdering Kevin Gregg or trading a veteran. So at that time maybe the regular contributors should create FanPosts instead of posting “Fuck Kevin Gregg” or “Anyone but Cesar” in the daily BDs
Less big words and more exclamation marks
by Astronaut Mike Dexter on Mar 16, 2011 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions
just wanna point out,
it IS spring training, there are no really cutthroat position battles (what, fifth starter? fourth outfielder? Starting second baseman?) to talk about. And just because someone is listed down there as a Goomba or Koopa Troopa doesn’t mean their fanposts don’t count. After all, they are listed for the very reason that they DO contribute to the community, and there have been a fair number of good fanposts this offseason—we’re just all ready for baseball now. There’s only so much you can say about spring training games.
"And everything about that was about that."
-The Hurk
by Steve. on Mar 16, 2011 12:25 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Preach, brother, preach
We NEED games to start!!!!
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
I definitely understand the desire for more FanPosts,
but let’s not knock the open thread format. If I’m at work, it’s great to know that I just have to keep one tab open, and I’m not going to miss any of the day’s discussion (as long as Mario’s enemies mention new front page posts in Bird Droppings — please keep doing that!). I think a lot of it is exactly what Steve mentions above — it’s Spring Training, and the O’s made all their offseason moves fairly early on (except for Vlad). There just isn’t that much to talk about baseball-wise until games start — let alone in the kind of in-depth analysis that we try to encourage in FanPosts.
That said, I’m bouncing around some ideas for semi-regular FanPosts I could write once games do start.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -- Earl Weaver
I think we want more FP, not less BD discussion
FPs can be focused on one topic and generate discussion on one specific topic, which can be treated in more depth and clarity than sharing a BD thread with discussions of bread and ammo.
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
and,
they can generate ongoing discussion about that topic over days or weeks. I view that as a big plus.
Very true
and a point I hadn’t fully considered, but a very important one.
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
Right, I see where you both are coming from.
I can see both sides of it. When almost all discussion is in the open thread, it makes it easy to be sure you see everything, but discussions on a particular topic tend to end after just one day, or even a few hours. When discussions on topics are mostly in FanPosts, they last longer, but you have to keep extra tabs open for posts that may only get one or two new comments per day. Of course, maybe trying to push more discussion to FanPosts will make them more active – I guess I wasn’t a regular here until after they died down a bit.
I guess what I’m trying to get at is, I would hate to go from (1) a daily 300-comment open thread, and the occasional excellent FanPost that draws lots of comments, to (2) a daily 150-comment open thread, and a new FanPost each day or so that spawns 5 or 10 comments on day one and then sits mostly idle until it drops off the list. And about two-thirds of the FanPosts I’ve seen since joining are of the latter variety. Really good FanPosts – the ones that get several recs and stay at the top of the list for weeks – are great, but the sort that pop up after a topic’s been largely hashed out in an open thread, or only consist of a two- or three-paragraph blurb and a dozen comments, just seem silly to me.
That said, I’m probably in the minority on this one.
"You can't sit on a lead and run a few plays into the line and just kill the clock. You've got to throw the ball over the damn plate and give the other man his chance. That's why baseball is the greatest game of them all." -- Earl Weaver
I agree with this
I love the Open Threads for all the random talk as well as Orioles talk. Although most of the time I don’t have time to get involved in many discussions, it’s always a nice way to relax after a long work day and coming home and doing all the dad/husband work.
More Fan Posts would be nice, and if it cuts down on a little bit of clutter (logging on to CC to a 700+ comment thread on a random day when the O’s aren’t even playing) that’ll probably help too.
Stacey, I think issuing this challenge is a good first step.
Like you said, maybe people have been a bit intimidated by the guidelines. Of course, those of us who remember the likes of Corey’s Corner, Rosana, or that John Gibbons fanpost, know that spelling certain things out was necessary. Maybe others were discouraged from trying to post their own, as a result. If so, then just your saying, “Hey, it’s OK” should go a long way.
The fact that the legendary poor fanposts were all made by people who weren’t actually a part of the CC community is a pretty big factor as well. You got the impression these people were just looking for any Orioles blog to dump their thoughts on and were probably making the post five minutes after finding the site. Someone who’s active on the site, or at least lurks enough to understand what we are like, is not going to have that same problem. But like you noted, I think that in trying to discourage the southfloridao’sfans of the world, it may be intimidating for active members to try to write something.
Seeing more of that would be cool. It’s neat seeing people flex their writing muscles, and no matter how much content the CC cadre of writers generates, there’s always going to be plenty of angles we are not discussing. Though I do think last season we had it to where there was an original article on most weekdays.
With regards to the fanposts in particular, though, I think looking only at that column is a bit misleading. There are several people who write posts that could be fanposts in their nature, but they have done it regularly and so you know them and trust them. Now they’re on the writing crew for the site and they have front page privileges and can bypass the fanpost step. Andrew has been a writing machine through the offseason, for instance, and James F had his regular posts about developing prospects and assets and such during last season.
Anyway, I like the way things are on the site right now as far as the content flow. But I encourage anyone who wants to write something more in-depth to not be shy about it and take the plunge. :)
"You can always tell Yankees fans by the total vacancy which occupies the space where most other people have faces." - J. K. O'Toole (paraphrased)
by Eat More Esskay on Mar 16, 2011 12:46 PM EDT reply actions
ahahahaha Corey's Corner!
I had completely forgotten. Good times.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Aha!
I remember when we had that first Blogger Day at OPACY and they were taking us up to see Gary Thorne & Buck Martinez. We stepped on the elevator, duck and Stacey walked in and stood in the corner. I said “Hey are you guys standing in Corey’s Corner?” And they looked at me like I was fucking crazy!
The game ball. Thanks. Roger. I'll put this with my collection of personal achievements. I mean, not right next to the good shit, but still.
That may have been the way we were looking at you
but it might not have been because of that comment. :)
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
well done
I love your pic, by the way. So adorable.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
Thanks!
I need a new one, it used to be him in Orioles clothes, but I changed it for the football season. He doesn’t have any new O’s clothes yet for this spring/summer, I can’t wait to get him some! I hope he’ll be as good at games this year as he was last year, but he’s 2 now and more independent and less patient, so I don’t know how that’ll work out.
Bought him a new Markakis shirt today
no pictures yet though, but the new one is him swinging a bat. He’s a natural, this was a while back and it was the first time he picked up a bat, and he swung it perfectly the first time without me showing him.
New poster, my 2 cents
New poster here but Ive followed the blogs for about a year now. I decided to chime in with my 2 cents.
I find reading the majority of the posts to be helpful and humorous. There is a lot of knowledge on this (and other blogs) and I think what Stacey, and Z, and duck have built works. So what if there are differing opinions on things. Everyone will not agree to everything someone says. Thats the brilliance of it all.
I live in Bosox country but I am an Orioles fan for life. I don’t pretend to know stats like most people here, or care for that matter. I like to see other people who are passionate enough about their favorite team to, despite losing season after losing season, continue to post. That’s why I read. It’s entertaining and informative. Kudos to all of you who have made it what it is.
Hello!
Just because you know how to read, doesn't mean you'll like the book.
by arlingtonOsFan on Mar 16, 2011 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Greetings and salutations
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
Well said
I think that’s how most of us were before we started posting, feel free to stick around, you’ll need some friendly company during the season living in Red Sox land.
Welcome!
And thanks. :)
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
Ill go by whatever....
You can call me whatever. I don’t take offense easily :)
Its my hiking name up here in New Hampsha.
by HardcoreIdiot on Mar 17, 2011 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Here's a great fanpost
On a different site (the Caps blog, japersrink) , but I thought it was a pretty stellar example and deserves more link-to’s regardless.
Also, how come we never have .gifs on here?
Just because you know how to read, doesn't mean you'll like the book.
Stacey HATES gifs
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
Bummer.
But, good to know anyway.
Just because you know how to read, doesn't mean you'll like the book.
by arlingtonOsFan on Mar 16, 2011 3:35 PM EDT up reply actions
I think what Stacey hates is that gifs beget gifs.
The first gif might be funny (especially if it’s a wayward O blingee) but the next six probably aren’t. And that stuff clogs up the comments for people who are scrolling down later or whatever.
"You can always tell Yankees fans by the total vacancy which occupies the space where most other people have faces." - J. K. O'Toole (paraphrased)
by Eat More Esskay on Mar 16, 2011 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't hate gifs if they're good
But people just post shit for the sake of posting it. And when you’re in a gamethread that already has 500+ comments and people bitching about their slow computers, they’re not exactly what we need.
However, I’m a fan of stuff if it’s funny or appropriate. Did y’all see the Nyjer Morgan gif thread at Lookout Landing? Brilliant.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
Got it...
But why not in the actual posts? Seems like they’ve been used to great effect as instructive tools in posts on other sites. I’m not faulting anyone of course, I have no idea how to make them (nor do I know enough about baseball to make a worthwhile point anyway), but someone like James F or Andrew_G could probably work some magic with it, right?
Just because you know how to read, doesn't mean you'll like the book.
by arlingtonOsFan on Mar 16, 2011 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions
If someone wanted to do something like that, I'd be fine with it
I have no idea how to do that and don’t foresee myself learning.
They don't have to be good. They just have to be there. - EME
wait...you want me to put up random gifs of Nyjer Morgan in my front page posts?
because I will do that. I will do the shit out of that.
Free Chris Tillman!
I think the Orioles need to give us some new storylines. “If the Orioles want to end their streak of (insert current number) consecutive losing seasons, (inert current young player names here) need to play up to their high expectations.”
The team needs to change the narrative. We all think the farm system is better now. We think this crop of young players has great potential. We’ve all probably thought/hoped that before (Bedard/Dubose/Riley/Ainsworth/etc). When the Orioles actually take that next step, there’ll be plenty of fanpost material.
Probably not by me, though. I mostly contribute through sarcasm.
Thanks Stacey
This was a good piece and I have been reluctant to contribute. I enjoy reading the posted articles and I glance at the comments.
Unfortunately, I come to Camden Chat to mainly read about the Orioles. As someone who has tried to jump into the comments in both Oriole and other related topics, I don’t find it either fun or informative. At best I’m ignored and more likely told I’m wrong. All that’s fine and frankly I expect it. Its just that it makes it easy to comment less.
Overall Camden Chat is a great site and I check it everyday. I will try to make more of an effort to contribute and enjoy whatever comes from it. The baseball season actually starting will help.
Thanks
John S West Jr
by Adam double bubble on Mar 17, 2011 8:28 AM EDT reply actions
What? Did someone say something?
KIDDING!
A d d, we’re going try and do a better job of being a bit nicer to those posting.
"Don't be intimidated by other teams. You guys got bubble gum cards, too. Let's go." - Buck Showalter
Very funny
I was hoping for this. Looking forward to a great Oriole Season
John S West Jr
by Adam double bubble on Mar 17, 2011 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions

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