Thursday Bird Droppings
by 2632 on Aug 25, 2011 7:35 AM EDT
in Open Threads
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PrintObviously, the terrible news that Mike Flanagan has left us for the Big Memorial Stadium in the Sky is the dominant story in Birdland journalism this morning. Flanny was Birdland. He was one of us, and he will be sorely missed.
Stan The Fan: Remember how Flanagan lived - CSN Baltimore
"For my part, I am fighting the urge to want to know exactly what Flanny's last moments were like. I’d rather remember the last time I saw Mike, at the Orioles Hall of Fame Induction luncheon as he introduced O's trainer Richie Bancells. Flanagan was funny, light-hearted and clearly in the moment as one of the lasting consciences of the Orioles' organization."
Eisenberg: Flanagan was soul of Orioles - CSN Baltimore
"When the Orioles closed out their 37-year run at Memorial Stadium in 1991, they staged a farewell weekend of games that built to an emotional crescendo that had all of Baltimore in tears as an era ended. The team carefully selected Mike Flanagan to throw the final pitch. He was the consummate Oriole of the 1970s and 1980s, a bulldog-tough left-handed pitcher who won 23 games and the American League’s Cy Young award in 1979. Although he was near the end of his career at that point, the challenging task of giving a rousing finish to a franchise’s glory days didn’t overwhelm him. He could rise to an occasion like few others. He ambled in from the bullpen in the ninth inning and struck out a pair of Detroit Tigers as a packed house of more than 57,000 fans and virtually every great player in Orioles history looked on. "I was a mess," he said later, after a "Field of Dreams" postgame ceremony that remains one of the best Baltimore sports moments of the past half-century." That afternoon is by far my best memory of Flanagan, who died Wednesday at age 59.
Orioles Insider: Sharing thoughts about Mike Flanagan - baltimoresun.com
A collection of some from around Birdland.
I was once Mike Flanagan's biggest fan | Roar From 34
"I haven't drawn any great conclusions about what is the most appropriate response to sad news about a public figure, even - or especially - when the news hits close to home. In the case of Mike Flanagan, whose talents peaked at the same time as my childhood imagination, my reaction is simply this: Thanks for the memories."
Tim Kurkjian - Cy Young winner Mike Flanagan, 1951-2011 - ESPN
''Flanny,' as everyone called him, had not been his usual personable, hilarious self in recent years. The many losses he took as the Orioles general manager wore on him, and he took them home. Being replaced as GM in 2008 depressed him even more. He returned to broadcasting in 2010, and again became one of the best color commentators in the game, but he still wasn't the guy I remember turning to after so many games for a line, a laugh or an observation. "I'm getting back to my old self," he told me last year. But the last time I saw him, less than a week ago, he didn't look very good. And now he's gone, and all of Baltimore is weeping that one of the greatest Orioles is gone before age 60."
Jones dealing with lingering soreness, may not play Thursday - baltimoresun.com
"I have a sore chest muscle, sore shoulder," Jones said. "The soreness in my shoulder and chest went into my neck, and I’m just sore everywhere."
Daniel Moroz: Simon making strides as an effective rotation option - MASN
"Look at his stuff: a two-seam fastball that averages 94-95 mph even as a starter and has decent movement, a four-seamer he'll occasionally mix in to righties to good effect; a splitter that looks like the fastball before the bottom falls out, a slider that might be more of a slurve at the moment given that it's slower and has more sweeping break; and a cutter he tends to use away to righties (but not really inside to lefties, who he hasn't often thrown it to). That's a four- or five-pitch arsenal with pitches everywhere from around 75 to 97 mph."
Buster Olney: Remembering Mike Flanagan, funniest man in baseball - ESPN
"For Flanny, the stories were as much part of baseball as the sport itself -- the community of baseball, the shared experience." - edited to add this nice tribute from Buster Olney
Mike Flanagan Career Highlights - The Hardball Times
One more Flanny link. Lots of good memories in here.
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Damn. Very hard to settle down.
I suspect that for many fans of my age — Flanny’s contemporaries — it’s like saying goodbye to part of your youth. Who does that “well”? You don’t just decide, “OK now, let’s man up here and move on.”
I’ll watch today, of course. It’s what you do.
Go O’s!
If you've been away, we still suck. And yes, we willl step outside and say that.
Its not just that generation
Even some of us younger fans have a hard time with it. Growing up with the Orioles, after the hall of famers, the next name always mentioned was Mike Flanagan. And even though I don’t really have any memories of actually seeing him play (I was only at a few games in Memorial stadium at a young age in the early 90’s), in my mind he’s always been a part of the team, just in different capacities. I have to admit, it was a rough morning waking up, turning on MLB Network at 5am and the first thing I see is a crying Jim Palmer.
by BigCountry14 on Aug 25, 2011 8:41 AM EDT up reply actions
I think it is indeed a little different for generations
Im in the same boat as you, not growing up seeing these guys. All I have are 2nd hand memories passed down from my dad about the glory days of the birds with long tenured players. People who watched them during that time have seen how things have changed with loyallties to teams and winning ways to free agency and what will now be 14 straight losing years. When I hear stories of “Brooksy”, Frank, “Booooog” and the like, they are all great stories but it seem foreign to me because they are in fact just stories.
That being said, it is sad for me because these are the people I grew up hearing about, becoming the foundation of my favorite team. My brother for example, who is a few years older, his favorite player is Brooks even though he never saw one diving stop or sawed-off helmet wearing at-bat. It is because of stories and allure that makes people like us venerate players we have never even seen.
Wieters likes throwing out fast runners because he's jealous.
+1
I was -2 years old when he was drafted. My memories of Flanagan as a player are fuzzy from the early 80’s, but clear in the early 90’s.
But I got to meet the man twice, once during an autograph signing (I wasn’t asking for his autograph) and once during a church-organized breakfast meet and greet. That was special – it was more or less an excuse to sit down with a former player, ask them questions & listen to them tell all their stories. He was fantastic in that setting.
From the Land of Pleasant Living...
Flanagan as a Blue Jay never happened
Eff those guys.
"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know, that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom?" ~ Death
posting from sb nation app.
I’m so confused.
Say no to Prince Fielder in 2012.
by Knubles and Bits on Aug 25, 2011 9:05 AM EDT via iPhone app reply actions
You're confused that you're posting from your iphone app?
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Aug 25, 2011 9:07 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm confused by the app.
It’s worse than just using the mobile site. I’m failing to see its usefulness. I can’t tell which of my sites have new stories and it doesn’t tell you how many new comments for each story.
Say no to Prince Fielder in 2012.
by Knubles and Bits on Aug 25, 2011 9:13 AM EDT via iPhone app up reply actions
I don't like how if we sign in we can't see all the blogs we are a part of
We have to re-choose everything? Just doesn’t make sense.
@sibsInExile
Nothing about it makes sense.
The only thing I like about it is the main news page. Until some improvements are made I’ll be sticking to the mobile version.
Say no to Prince Fielder in 2012.
by Knubles and Bits on Aug 25, 2011 9:16 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
You're right
Just used it for like 5 minutes. None of it makes sense. All the stuff on the app would have been good additions on top of things we are used to, but by themselves it doesn’t make sense.
The interface is all slick and cool, but I feel like I’ll never use it.
@sibsInExile
I'm guessing because some people belong to a million blogs
If you look at my profile page you’ll see I’m technically a member of at least fifteen SBN blogs, but most of them I never go to, it was to comment once or twice or something. I wouldn’t want all of those on a list on my app.
Of course, I haven’t had a chance to use it (I don’t have an iPhone) so I have no idea what it’s really like.
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
Then I understand the membership part
but what about blogs you favorited? Nobody does too many of those
@sibsInExile
that's a good idea
and maybe something they didn’t think of. Perhaps for the next version they’ll get on it.
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
first versions almost always suck
I bet the next one will incorporate autocomments and some type of ‘Z’ substitute, etc.
@sibsInExile
wait, what?
They should. An open thread is one of the examples in the screen cap they sent me!
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
Been staying clear of the O's due to heartfail for quite awhile...
…but this brought me back in. I mean… damn. May heaven be full of 162 wins, buddy.
http://www.realityfish.com
I hope Flanny found the peace he was looking for, and that his heart and soul now are at rest.
We’ll miss him down here, to be sure.
Ya know
For all our postings on why the O’s are struggling, I think Flanny came up very rarely, if at all, as having a role in it. If that is the reason why he is gone, then there must be a very vocal minority out there about whom I haven’t heard, but who seemed to have his attention. If it is the reason, it had to be a pretty constant pounding to wear down a guy who seemed so damned steady. Either that, or it’s the fact that the brain has tons of chemicals in it that makes us do funny shit if one gets even a little bit out of whack. IF it turns out that he took his own life, then the act itself was selfish, but you cannot use that to discount everything the man has done in his life that was far from it. I’m gonna miss the guy.
"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know, that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom?" ~ Death
Living in the
Baltimore area community as many of us do, I hardly if at all here people blaming him. Peter gets the brunt of that. It’s just so hard to believe this is the reason. If it is, I’d love find out who these people are that still was blaming flanny.
by Michael18 on Aug 25, 2011 9:44 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
maybe not anymore...
but at the time macphail was hired, it was pretty clear from public sentiment that flanagan was done and it sure as hell. wasn’t all PA’s fault. he took a lot of flack for being a puppet and his methods of player evaluation were scorned by statheads, but i think you can make an argument that he left the org in better shape than he found it.
"the secret to a happy ending is knowing when to roll the credits"
by j.q. higgins on Aug 25, 2011 9:48 AM EDT up reply actions
It's all still speculation
But obviously if Flanny was despondent over this very thing, it was a sympton of another condition he was struggling with. So in that sense it doesn’t matter if people were blaming him or not.
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
Absolutely.
Thank you, Stacey. It is amazing to me how few people have said that.
Exactly.
The terrible thing is that when a person ends their life, it has little to do with whatever their “stated” reasons may be. They do it because there’s something misfiring inside them, and that imbalance is simply looking for justification.
Someone who wants to commit suicide will find a reason to do so.
http://www.realityfish.com
Not true.
Suicide happens when a person’s pain exceeds their resources to cope with it, whether it be emotional, physical, whatever.
People who are in enough pain to consider suicide are not trying to “find a reason to do so” – in fact the opposite is true. Research shows that most people who complete suicide reached out or mentioned it in some way, some how, within the 6 months before completion.
Absolutely...
I’m going to refrain from any speculation on Flanny’s death until the relevant facts are known, but some of the people commenting about suicide appear to know very little about it. Suicide is not some inevitable result that arises solely from something going “wrong” with a person’s brain.
My heart goes out to Mike’s wife and three daughters, and all those who loved him. I don’t think it’s appropriate for me to say more than that at this time.
"If you know how to cheat, start now." - Earl Weaver
Not sure how you reach that conclusion.
The fact a person may be suffering from depression does not mean that outside factors and influences don’t matter.
But rather than argue about what led Mike Flanagan to end his life, I’ll pray for his family and for his soul.
"The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people; it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government - lest it come to dominate our lives and interests".
- Patrick Henry –
I didn't say they don't matter
But, and look, I really hate speculating on this, if he was suffering from depression that is what needed to be treated in order for him to recover, if he was really truly depressed or had some other type of disorder, the Orioles simply being good again (or having been good when he was there) isn’t going to fix that.
Anyway, I’m done talking about it. We don’t even know what happened and we probably never will.
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
Yeah, he should have been seeing a therapist (if he wasn't already).
Depression can be treated.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
For all our postings on why the O’s are struggling, I think Flanny came up very rarely, if at all, as having a role in it.
Now yes. Most of the hate is directed toward MacPhail these days. But when he was GM, there was plenty of blame assigned toward him, Beattie, and Duquette. I’m sure if you search the archives at CC, you’ll find negative comments about his work as a GM.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
What are the bets today, WW?
Braves look pretty good at -125 over the Cubs. Brandon Beachy’s pitching. Preseason football too….Carolina’s a 3 point underdog to Cincy….but Cincy sucks….
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
Gambling on preseason football has got to be a cry for help.
"So I said, 'Looks like they've finally got Ogea in the pen. I wonder if the glove fits.' I thought I was going to get fired. " - Mike Flanagan, RIP
by Eat More Esskay on Aug 25, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions
I was going to say that a while ago but decided against it
I have a huge gambling problem, even betting on 3rd league English soccer and obscure college teams. But I won’t touch preseason football
@sibsInExile
What a horrific story
why is it that the O’s only receive the national spotlight due to tragedy or humiliation?
Lately we have been such a forgettable franchise and it gets redundant saying orioles lose all the time
Wieters likes throwing out fast runners because he's jealous.
A little off topic
I clicked on a couple of the video links when the news broke and on a few of them advertisements came up! For other things advertisements are okay but for a tragedy? I think it’s a little disrespectful.
Wieters likes throwing out fast runners because he's jealous.
I just added a new link
http://www.hardballtimes.com/main/blog_article/mike-flanagan-career-highlights/
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
Huh:
Aug. 31, 1984: After nearly a decade in baseball, Flanagan finally allows a grand slam. Seattle’s Jim Presley hits it off him. Flanagan will allow two more slams in his career.
"Your most precious possessions on offense are your twenty-seven outs." -- Earl Weaver
richard justice...
also has a nice flanny remembrance getting some play.
"the secret to a happy ending is knowing when to roll the credits"
My favorite part
If you do a Google search of Earl Weaver and Bill Haller, you’ll find Weaver’s profane tirade against the umpire after he’d called a balk against Flanny.
What you won’t see is what happened as Weaver finally was leaving the field. He passed by Flanagan and asked, "Did you balk?"
"I think I did," he said.
"Well bleep you too," he screamed.
"Grow nothing, buy the 'Pen" (Wieters Weiners)
by IggesRule13 on Aug 25, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I never get tired of Earl Weaver stories.
"So I said, 'Looks like they've finally got Ogea in the pen. I wonder if the glove fits.' I thought I was going to get fired. " - Mike Flanagan, RIP
by Eat More Esskay on Aug 25, 2011 11:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I think I am going to bleep someone today in honor of this story.
"Grow nothing, buy the 'Pen" (Wieters Weiners)
by IggesRule13 on Aug 25, 2011 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I've watched that tirade multiple times, and I never knew that part.
And, no, I didn’t ignore your comment, Luke E!
The more I’ve learned about baseball, the more I have learned to love Earl Weaver. While Altobelli and the O’s broke my heart in 1983, it was Earl’s team – pitching, defense, and the three-run homer.
What a great story, and rec’d.
Why look'st thou so?' -"With my crossbow
I shot the Albatross."
by RememberthePhitans on Aug 25, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
One non-Flanagan link
Felix Pie – He’s your buddy who never quite gets his stuff together
"Complacency is your demise." - Kerry King
I blame Luke Scott.
If he’d thrown more banana chips at Felix, we wouldn’t be in this mess.
"I put a pepper rub on the scallops so you have a little contrast. You have sweetness from the coconut oil and a little acidity from the splash of lemon." – Luke Scott
haha I said almost the same thing to my bf
I said Felix probably can’t play well with Luke Scott on the DL and not with the team, because there is no one around to throw banana chips.
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
I'm sure this got posted, but wow.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
Seriously!
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Aug 25, 2011 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Gotta love the Internet
"Grow nothing, buy the 'Pen" (Wieters Weiners)
by IggesRule13 on Aug 25, 2011 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Deadspin can be funny
But their commenters are a step above The Sun’s
Empty your mind, be formless, shapeless - like water. Now you put water into a cup, it becomes the cup, you put water into a bottle, it becomes the bottle, you put it in a teapot, it becomes the teapot. Now water can flow or it can crash. Be water, my friend.
by Astronaut Mike Dexter on Aug 25, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
sources confirmed that Flanagan took his own life ‘despondent over what he considered a false perception from a community he loved of his role in the team’s prolonged failure," according to the WBAL-TV’s sports director Gerry Sandusky.
Who the hell are these sources?
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
I don't get how they are continuing to publish stuff like that
without having to get more specific.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
Whenever the name of Mike Flanagan was mentioned
the mental image I get is with him standing on the mound, wearing that knee brace. To me, he was kind of a bionic man, patched together, but unbroken. I always pictured him as a guy who made the absolute most of what talents he had. Even if he wasn’t the most gifted, he would find a way to suceed.
All is transient.
I'm just heartbroken...
it’s been hard being an Orioles fan lately, even more so since I relocated to New England in 2000. But today is about as low as I can recall feeling as on O’s fan.
"If you know how to cheat, start now." - Earl Weaver
new front page post
http://www.camdenchat.com/2011/8/25/2383973/should-jeremy-guthrie-continue-wearing-46
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
Paying respects
I’m a longtime Phillies fan, but live in central PA with family from Baltimore. I’ve seen the Orioles more than any other team (in person), and my early memories are going to the stadium (Memorial, of course) with my grandparents and family. I will be at the Yard this weekend to root against the Yankees, actually.
I have a Flanagan autographed baseball, among others, on my credenza in my office. I used to love hearing Miller call games (later on) on the radio, which was always on in the summer. And I remember him winning a million games for the O’s.
It is sad to hear about his death, and the circumstances that have been alluded to. What a remarkable player and a part of the fabric of Orioles baseball for such a long time.
This is awful, and I hope that some good can come from it — perhaps a reduction of the stigma of mental illness in society and in professional sports. Perhaps a recognition of the dangers posed by major depression.
Again, terrible, terrible news, and my thoughts and sympathy to the family and to the Orioles community. Except Angelos.
Why look'st thou so?' -"With my crossbow
I shot the Albatross."
by RememberthePhitans on Aug 25, 2011 11:50 AM EDT reply actions
Simon's arsenal (minus the handgun)
Look at his stuff: a two-seam fastball that averages 94-95 mph even as a starter and has decent movement, a four-seamer he’ll occasionally mix in to righties to good effect; a splitter that looks like the fastball before the bottom falls out, a slider that might be more of a slurve at the moment given that it’s slower and has more sweeping break; and a cutter he tends to use away to righties (but not really inside to lefties, who he hasn’t often thrown it to). That’s a four- or five-pitch arsenal with pitches everywhere from around 75 to 97 mph.
The reason for the lower strikeout rate appears to actually be the offspeed stuff. His slider and split sometimes get left up in the zone a bit too much and even when they chase out of the zone, batters don’t seem to whiff all that often on them. On average, pitchers get hitters to miss those pitches when they swing more than 30 percent of the time; Simon is doing it just over 20percent of the time as a starter. I think there’s upside there, since the pitches themselves appear to be at least decent. If he can utilize them more effectively and get those whiff rates closer to 30 percent his strikeout rate should move towards the league average (7.1 K/9), allowing him to purhaps due a decent Edwin Jackson (combined 2008-2011) impersonation.
Seems like a pretty good assessment and along the lines of what I was saying yesterday.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
You and your fucking straw-man arguments.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Aug 25, 2011 12:41 PM EDT up reply actions
where was this quoted?
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
the daniel moroz article linked above.
"the secret to a happy ending is knowing when to roll the credits"
by j.q. higgins on Aug 25, 2011 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Yup ... a perfect assessment.
Except, just like you, he fails to note that despite his descriptions of the pitches in question, none of them rate above-average this year (and only one for his career – the one he throws least often), and that simply “throwing” a pitch in the direction of home plate doesn’t mean that it is a mlb-quality pitch or that it will result in objective success. In truth, despite what you and Moroz say about “his four- or five-pitch arsenal,” he has ONE pitch that is even above-average for his entire career; so talking about how hard he throws, or how much his ball appears to move, etc. etc. etc., is all just wind because they haven’t historically resulted in outs. At the end of the discussion yesterday, you retreated to the position that Simon might be our best option this year in the number-five starter slot. I’m totally fine with that, you’re right that we don’t have anybody better right now. Of course, that’s more a commentary on the state of the organization than it is Simon’s quality as a pitcher. Where I have problems, though, if he’s in the rotation heading into next season. He might be useful in the bullpen … which is what I said yesterday (and which is what you argued with). So are we really still having this conversation?
you mean
None of them rate above average according to fangraphs. There is no perfect measurement of pitch quality – even statheads will tell you that. Neither Moroz nor I attribute the quality of his pitches to “simply throwing a pitch in the direction of home plate” – we both talked about the velocity, movement, and deception of the pitches. You are stuck on outcomes which are not necessarily a reflection of the quality of the pitch or even the execution (I would assume somebody that keeps reverting to a single stat on fangraphs would understand that not everything that doesn’t result in an out is within a pitcher’s control).
And for at least the 3rd time I’ll point out that it’s pretty silly to say that a pitch that rates as -0.3 according to fangraphs metric is not MLB quality. That’s clearly in the margin of error and within the “mlb quality” range.
Lastly what the hell do you mean “retrested”? My assertion the entire time was that his arsenal was plenty good enough to be a number 5. And I don’t just mean that in our rotation – most rotations around the league have a shitty number 5 starter and he would fit in just fine.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
You mean Pie falling over while trying to catch a ball isn't Simon's fault??
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Aug 25, 2011 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
There is no perfect measurement of pitch quality – even statheads will tell you that. Neither Moroz nor I attribute the quality of his pitches to "simply throwing a pitch in the direction of home plate" – we both talked about the velocity, movement, and deception of the pitches. You are stuck on outcomes which are not necessarily a reflection of the quality of the pitch or even the execution (I would assume somebody that keeps reverting to a single stat on fangraphs would understand that not everything that doesn’t result in an out is within a pitcher’s control).
Out of curiosity, why the hate toward the fangraph pitch quality factor? Andrew mentioned that its calculated based the number of runs given up on that pitch and then standardized against league average. I’m not saying this is the end all, be all measure of pitch quality. But it seems like ONE good way to measure pitch quality. I mean I certainly with you that it’s not perfect, but I wouldn’t dismiss it either.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
Where do you see hate or dismissal? I just said it wasn't perfect.
And clearly if it’s just a measure of runs given up on that pitch it’s much worse than not perfect given what we all know about what a pitcher controls once the ball is put in play.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
I haven’t followed this conversation so apologies in advance if I misunderstood it. Bohknows said Simon may have mutliple pitches but they’re not good and uses fangraph data to support that opinion. You then say, “None of them rate above average according to fangraphs,” thus casting doubt on the veracity of fangraph data (?). And you also say, “You are stuck on outcomes which are not necessarily a reflection of the quality of the pitch or even the execution.” I suppose there’s wiggle room in “not necessarily” but the language at the very least suggests that using fangraph data to support his position isn’t a good move because it doesn’t necessarily reflect the quality of pitches. So it seems like you don’t see fangraphs data as admissible evidence.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
Right - I am certainly skeptical of it - it's clearly not perfect
I’m not saying it’s not A good move, but it’s certainly not definitive in any way. You can’t quote that (especially when two of the pitches rate as within 1 point of league average using that clearly less than perfect measure) and then act like it’s case closed.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
But skepticism and pointing out that it's far less than perfect =/= hate or dismissal
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
I should also say, and I’m not sure if I’m interpreting fangraphs correctly, Simon’s pitches don’t seem terrible either. They’re pretty close to average in several cases which corresponds to his slightly below average ERA (ERA+ 94).
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
Exactly
And that’s really been my whole point the entire time – his repertoire is perfectly acceptable for a number 5 starter.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
again, i haven't read every post
but is anybody arguing he can’t be a 5 starter? i mean i’m fine with the bp with simon too. but i wouldn’t outright dismiss him as a 5 starter based on what i’ve seen. personally, i would rather see simon in the bp and leave the 5 spot as a developmental spot, but really, I don’t have strong opinions either way.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
haha yes boh is arguing exactly that
This whole thing started because Boh said that Simon is a “one pitch” pitcher which means he belongs in the bullpen and that a number 5 starter IS somebody who’s developing for future 1-3 starter potential.
I’d be just fine with him in the bullpen too, but it’s not because he doesn’t have the arsenal to start. And I’d be equally fine with using the 5th spot for development if we had somebody to develop.
I am eating you, motherfucker. You cannot hurt me. - PhilR8
boh, so you don't think Simon has any potential to be a #5 starter?
Eh, I don’t know, Simon’s AAA stats as a starter sucks balls. Frankly, doubt over his ability to remain as a starter is a position I don’t have a problem with either. Unless Simon has learned a new pitch recently, his arsenal as a starter hasn’t worked very well historically.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
Afternoon game thread is ready to roll
http://www.camdenchat.com/2011/8/25/2384101/game-128-orioles-50-77-twins-55-74-1-10pm
We are giving the baseball gods a hell of a challenge. Jo-Jo Reyes is starting and the forfeit lineup is deployed.
"So I said, 'Looks like they've finally got Ogea in the pen. I wonder if the glove fits.' I thought I was going to get fired. " - Mike Flanagan, RIP
by Eat More Esskay on Aug 25, 2011 12:48 PM EDT reply actions
More on Flanagan
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AhM7qsc4xjg88oegZ7WBvr4RvLYF?slug=ap-obit-flanagan
A police investigation revealed that the 59-year-old pitcher was upset about financial issues. He left no note.
There was a moment of silence at Yankee Stadium on Thursday before New York faced the Oakland Athletics. Flanagan’s picture was posted on the video board.
meaningless game in a mostly meaningless season of meaningless meaninglessness. emperor nobody, A's Nation.
Looks like Jim Jam is headed back to Cleveland
according to the Twitter
Giraffes have absurdly strong necks.
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